Deloitte Quit Welfare To Work: Are The Wheels Falling Off The Workfare Gravy Train?

rats-sinking-shipIn a humiliating blow for Iain Duncan Smith’s flagship back to work programme, one of the largest investors have announced they are selling their stake in the scheme.

Tax dodging specialists Deloitte own half of Ingeus, one of the welfare-to-work companies who are contracted to carry out the disastrous Work Programme.  They are now selling that stake and pulling out of the sector altogether.

This decision comes despite George Osborne’s announcement of a quarter of a billion pound hand out to the welfare-to-work sector as part of his upcoming mass workfare scheme.  It suggests that all is not well in the welfare-to-work sector.

Back in the glory days of welfare-to-work unemployment was steadily falling due to a long period of economic growth.  Welfare-to-work companies made billions on the back of this, convincing a succession of clueless Labour ministers that this was all down to their wonderful job search training.  The idea that unemployment was caused by unemployed people, who just needed to be fixed, was well and truly established.  The reality, as anyone who ever attended one of their schemes knows, was that these companies simply picked up job outcome fees every time anyone found a job under their own steam.

As soon as the economy started to dip suddenly all these job outcomes began to disappear.  This didn’t stop Iain Duncan Smith falling for the racket hook, line and sinker and announcing a £6billion pound Work Programme to be run by these parasites.

Companies like A4e, Ingeus, G4S and Serco flocked to bid for Work Programme contracts, with hugely optimistic promises of success.  That success never materialised and the payment-by-results model has meant that this tax payer funded hand out has not brought the huge profits expected by the likes of Deloitte who had invested so heavily in the programme.

Only Iain Duncan Smith could turn a licence to print money into a liability for the companies involved in his endless crazy schemes which do little more than bully and humiliate claimants unable to find a job.  But by designing a succession of back to work schemes which are undeliverable in practice and have no impact on whether people get back into work he may have managed what seemed impossible and broken the welfare-to-work sector.

Ingeus will remain in business for now, with rumours that Serco may buy Deloitte’s stake.  They are almost certain to bid for contracts in the recently announced tender for ‘Community Work Placements’, the latest fantasy scribbled down by George Osborne on the back of an envelope which will see up to two hundred thousand people forced to work unpaid for six months.  But this scheme contains a very real hidden liability for welfare-to-work firms.

Community Work Placements have already been piloted and proved to be a disaster.  The companies involved were only able to find 63% of participants a placement.  Under George Osborne’s plans, if the companies involved cannot find a placement for claimants then they will have to provide full time job search instead.  This will lead back to the bad old days of Tony Blair’s New Deal when thousands of people were forced to sit around in the offices of welfare-to-work providers twiddling their thumbs because there were not enough workfare placements available.  But this time round, presumably in an effort to encourage companies to focus on finding people workfare rather than real jobs, the welfare-to-work companies won’t be paid for this.  They will only get paid when someone starts on workfare.

This astonishing twist shows that it is now more important to this Government that unemployed people are punished with unpaid work then they actually get a job.  And there isn’t even enough workfare to go round, let alone real jobs.  So welfare-to-work companies bidding for the latest scheme are likely to be plunged into financial chaos as they are forced to warehouse tens of thousands of people out of their own pockets.

The smart operators in welfare-to-work got out whilst the going was good – like ex A4e boss Emma Harrison, the UK’s biggest benefit cheat who made millions on the back of workfare and benefit sanctions.  Now Deloitte are following suit, and they are a company that knows a thing or too about financial scams.  Despite the bungled attempts of this Government to keep the whole shoddy racket afloat, it seems that the future is far from rosy for the corporate poverty pimps in the welfare-to-work sector.

HT to @Hephaestus7 for spotting this via the BBC

Follow me on twitter @johnnyvoid

140 responses to “Deloitte Quit Welfare To Work: Are The Wheels Falling Off The Workfare Gravy Train?

  1. Haha was just going to mention that

    As per, Fester McVile (shes spooky and shes kooky … she’s terrible fester mcVile, doodly do, click click, doodly do, click click [adams family]) is spinning it as “a good thing” (suposedly selling because its such a good value for money) when the fact is its running like mad away from the deal as its under-cut bids comming in next year mean its no longer going to provide massive profits and may even make a loss.

    What is it with Fester McVile and lies? She’s obviously been taught at the same “universities” as Idiot Drunken Schmidt… or perhaps IDS has taught her personally how to lie in the face of facts.

  2. Glad you mentioned deloitte. They were the company that helped vodaphone fiddle the taxes by doing a sweetheart deal with HMRC..and to add insult to injury had the nerve to recruit school leavers to work unpaid for them using the tuition fee hike claiming that since many would be put off going to university because of the tuition fee hike they would be better off working for nothing and being trained to become the next generation of corps tax avoidance consultants…

  3. I’ve been thinking that people won’t put up with Workfare in this country the way they do in America because we have a different spirit here. / By the way, does France have Workfare? I really can’t see it working there.

    • overburdenddonkey

      michael
      correct, there is indeed a general and deep natural rejection of these schemes within the psyche of the british worker, that they remove paid work from the jobs market, remove the prospect of real on the job work training and a real wage experience, which is after the main point of working..do much harm and weaken an individuals prospects, of finding quality, well paid work and/or demanding higher pay, and better conditions of employment…there is no jobs “bubble”, for the majority of british workers, these schemes do have a severe and detrimental impact on the quality of available work…to work for less than the prescribed hourly min wage is an insult to the integrity of a human being…even the min wage is, not described as a living wage….

  4. This happened to me today. Arrived at the job centre on time. I’ve never been late and have always met all the job search criteria. Showed the woman seeing me my job search diary for the past 2 weeks. I’ve seen her around many times before so she’s not a new face but this was the first time she’d seen me.
    ‘Where’s your job search for today, the 5th?’ she demanded.
    ‘My 2 weeks goes from Tuesday to 2 weeks Monday, so I haven’t done today’s yet. It will be on my next job search diary in 2 weeks time, like this one.’ I point to my recent diary on her side of the desk.
    ‘But you’ve got nothing written down for today.’
    ‘No I haven’t for the reason I’ve just told you. Plus, it’s 9.30 in morning. I left the house at 8 to get here. There’s not been any time for me to do a job search so far today.’
    ‘So you admit you haven’t done any job search today.’
    ‘For the reasons I’ve just told you.’
    ‘I’m going to sanction you for not meeting your agreement’
    ‘Eh? I’d like to see your manager.’
    She waddles off confidently. I wait about 20 minutes for her manager. He turns up with her and explains that I’m going to be sanctioned for not meeting the conditions of my agreement.
    ‘I have met my agreement. In what way haven’t I?’ I ask him.
    ‘You haven’t given us a valid excuse for missing a day’s job search.’
    ‘Which day is that?’
    The manager looks at the woman. He doesn’t know any of the details.
    ‘Today,’ says the woman proudly.
    I detect a look of confusion on her manager’s face.
    I tell him what I told the woman. She then says to him, ‘He’s just admitted it again!’ and points at me as if catching me out red-handed.
    He tells her to go and wait for him in his office while he deals with me. He apologises several times.
    I ask for a complaint form. To rub it in I get him to spell both their names and then spell them back at him.
    Just shows how trigger happy they are. They can’t wait to shoot first. Even when they do ask questions they don’t understand the answers, and their managers are too ready to back them up without investigating.

    • I once complained to a job centre manager. He told me my adviser was an “expert”. I was almost speechless.

      • something survived...

        Expert in being a clueless twat and coldhearted bastard, probably. With a shiny laminated online degree in Advanced Bastardness from the University of Thatcher.

    • You couldn’t make it up! Good for you for standing your ground with the gits😀

    • they tried that bullshit on with me glad other people are standing there ground, they have unofficial sanction targets you see, if there not met they to could find them self on the other side of the desk!! more sanction doubts are raised on a friday than any other working day for the cunts in the dwp offices, because they have not met the targets so will use anything to get there individual. targets before there in the shit them selfs, i cant believe, what i am hearing from the likes of this blog and stuff it’s shocking. stay strong people your not alone there are thousands of us in the same boat.

    • Zenned
      They are nasty some advisers but some are stupid too. That adviser is clearly both. No way would that be upheld by the decision maker let alone tribunal.

      It’s a shame that with so many good people out there desperate for work and at the same time being abused for the position they find themselves in, that morons like that have quite good jobs when they really should be on the other side of the desk. How do these people get these jobs I often wonder.

      Fortunately most JC advisers I meet are decent but I have met a couple of horrible ones and they were rotten to the core.

      • This woman was both stupid and nasty. Her own stupidity made her blind to what I was saying and what she could read in front of her. She then got carried away with her spite, which has probably been stoked by sanctioning quotas or some such. No excuse there though. They probably employed her specifically because she has these 2 traits.

        Her manager realised his stupidity for accepting what she’d told him before finding out the reality himself. But I’m going to complain about him too because it’s going to be moments of stupidity like his that allow people like her to get away with it and do untold damage.

        • Yes I think you should complain if only to register this event to protect yourself agianst future sanction attempts. They failed this time but will be looking for any opportunity to ‘set the record straight’ I feel. This will be good evidence at any tribunal of their behaviour, blatant attempts to ‘manufacture’ sanctions against you which could help your case even if they have just cause to sanction you on that occasion.

          I feel that these types of staff and this style of threats by sanction are counter-productive in the long run as we are all trying to work towards a cohesive community. Employment will eventually pick up, people will find jobs but they will be left with a very bad feeling toward the state which will I’m sure embed itself into the general psyche and attitude. We will not bea united country – we will not be all pulling in the same direction in other words.

    • Another Fine Mess

      Unbelievable!

    • Either they are stupid or make up stuff to make you miserable…power trip…
      Wait till its them on the other side of the counter..

  5. And so it begins. Deloitte aren’t stupid, they can see which way the wind’s blowing. This six month workfare will never take off. I’ve just come off the WP, and they were having a hard enough time finding anyone who would want us on for four weeks, let alone twenty-six weeks. And when it doesn’t work they’ll have us coming in to the JC every day to sign on and do a job search just to teach us a lesson. Furthermore they’ll have us applying for every vacancy they think we’re reasonably capable of doing.

  6. something survived...

    What it shows is that there are blackened, folded-over banana skins that can out-think these people. I mean really! What divs!

    Recently they went and got the securipig over to come and stand right behind the claimant’s chair in a really menacing intimidating way. The reason: the Jobcentre staff said the claimant was threatening and dangerous. Actually he was complying with all the things you have to do in signing on, but the thing was, he had Tourette’s. Tourette’s is a spectrum with hundreds of subtypes, and this type did not involve shouting very loudly or swearing, or rude words. His type seemed to cause him to have physical tics/spasms like waving his ams in the air and fitting, and sometimes saying random neutral words involuntarily like ‘button’. This was last week. As far as I know they did not sanction him; but they actually were warning him about his behaviour! DUHHHHH!!
    The whole point is he has a disability and can’t control his Tourette’s, you prize idiots. People don’t do it for fun! I think their behaviour towards him constitutes a hate crime. They have no level they won’t sink to, being prepared to bully and belittle the elderly, single mothers, wheelchair users… Finding sillier and ever more implausible reasons for chucking them all off benefits. After all if you meet your quota you can get a chocolate egg! Someone decided he was fit for work so forced him to sign on, so here he is signing on, doing everything you asked of him – and then you object to his being present while having Tourette’s. Perhaps he could leave his Tourette’s at the door?!

    Leave your wheelchair or prosthetic legs at the entrance and crawl down the stairs to see your DWP Adviser. If we had enough money we were going to put in an assault course with a shark tank, crocodile pit, and gaping fiery hole to the centre of the earth, in between the door and the signing on desk. This will incentivise jobseekers to be more proactive and dynamic in their jobsearch.

    God bless Saint Margaret Thatcher!

    ‘All animals are tomorrow’s catfood, and some jobseekers make easier roadkill than others.’

    • Perhaps someone could make him a few business cards to hand out in such situations?

      (side 1)
      I have Tourette’s, its a medical condition.
      (side 2)
      You Sir/Madam are a cunt.
      Thank you for understanding.
      (Delete as applicable)

      Well I think its funny, but then I also suffer from hidden problems that sporadically show themselves to much consternation from even people who know me.

  7. off topic

    Can I get sanctioned for refusing self employed work if offered. I have an interview for some place and looked it up and it’s self employed sales crap.

    • The problem is, you’ve applied for the job, so the job centre might hold you to it. / Avoid this job like the plague though, because these jobs don’t pay anything – unless you’re like Alec Baldwin in Glengarry Glen Ross.

      • I’ve turned down interview in email. I just hope they don’t tell jobmatch. I’ve been googling the company and it’s a scam pyramid type marketing job.

    • No you can not Cephalus. You also cannot be sanctioned for Refusal of Employment if you turn down a job which is self employed or under 24 hours (if your availability is 40hrs per week. [Under 16 if your availability is 24hrs per week]) You cannot be sanction for turning down Zero hour contracts either. So dont let them bully you into it. (Im a Decision Maker)

      • Also dont volunteer the information – Basically dont tell the JCP you turned it down unless they ask. Then, if they do, simply point out it was self employed work.

      • Thanks for that I’ve been worried sick all night.

        • Universal Jobmatch is Shit

          If you don’t allow your jcp access to your UJ account, which you are perfectly entitled to do. You can pick and choose which jobs to tell them you have applied for and the ones you don’t want them to know about..

  8. HA HA HA HA HA , anything i read with terms like this ”sinking-ship In a humiliating blow for Iain Duncan smith ” are music to my ears the lying fat bastard!! stay strong people, he will defo be up before the select committee this time around.

  9. With Serco and G4S under investigation for fraud, and having their existing contracts reviewed by the government, could these two be the next to exit the workfare fiasco?
    And what happens if these do have to surrender their government contracts?

    • It depends especially when loudmouth from A4e claims DWP nicked all it’d best ideas from them and has the nerve to offer advice to govts in parliamentary submissions.. Oh and has been at number ten a few times too

    • What do they do???? They let the DWP award them £270 Million to oversee the “CAP” reward for failure.

  10. Steven2011@lavabit.com

    Iain Duncan-Smith always was as thick as shit and this just goes to prove that once again.This bloke is too intellectually challenged to be an MP let alone Her Majesty’s Secretary of State for such a vitally important and sensitive government department as the DWP.

    • He is also so intellectually challenged that he was ‘elected’ as leader of the Tory bastard party…..and stood a (albeit very slim) chance of becoming Prime Minister…..jeez!!!!

  11. Another Fine Mess

    The Waste Programme is on Radio 4 @ 8 pm tonite, if ne1s interested.
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b03gbxn8

  12. I don’t blame the people working at the Jobcentre for all these things that are happening, well not all of them anyway. Its the Government that are bringing in all these policies. My advisor seems like quite a nice person. She at least seems like she wants to help people. This Government don’t want to help anyone but themselves and their rich friends.

    • I’ve not signed on in years-but the advisors I saw THEN were helpful, caring & understading of my disabilty. I live in fear all the time now-I would imagine those people would have found a less soul destroying job by now😦

  13. Landless Peasant

    Deloitte have obviously washed their hands of the whole sorry mess, knowing full well that Gideon’s barking-mad 6 month ‘Help To Work’ scheme is yet more totally unworkable Tory fucking bullshit and will never happen. The writing is on the wall for the Work Programme, and hopefully for the Tories.

  14. Anyone been forced to go for job with highly dubious employer yet ? It must have happened by now surely

    • Yes,Salian Group on UJM do they really need over 5000 self employed door to door sales people? According to the JCP “Clerk” it is a golden opportunity! I suggest that she should apply,seemed a bit upset,wonder why?

    • Yes, me in 2011, for a scuzzy company that transported the sick, elderly and disruptive kids from a to b, I was a passenger assistant on minimum wage (well actually I worked 6 months at below minimum wage ). We had to pay for our own crb check as well. Then theboss bbegan bouncing our wage cheque. Mine bounced 4 times in 6 months. Boss man had 5 cars a Bentley just one. One girl told him she had no food in her cupboard so he told her eat the cupboard. I kid u not. One of the drivers sexually harassed me n 3 others, when we complained we were told we must of encouraged hI’m. In the end I was signed off sick for two months with depression n stress related illness. While I was off company went bust. Lucky I only had to sign on for 2 weeks b4 I found a new job!

      • I should also say I did that shitty job for 2 years!!.and I’m still on medication for depression n stress related migraine. But work cures all according to ids….!!

    • Mr X, encouraged me to apply for job Y with organisation Z.. Mr X claimed that wages were payable in arrears after a certain period in post. No wages were ever paid.to me by organisation Z. Mr X now works for organisation Y.

  15. Deloitte are scumbags

    Deloittes promotes mauritius as tax haven to avoid payouts to poor countries

  16. McVey is pleased and says that people only sell their interests at the “top of the market” hunting, I suppose, that Deloitte baling on the Work Programme is a sign of its success. Oh! Hang on, McVey! Even if you’re right you’ve just admitted that from here on everything associated with the Work Programme will worsen! Hoist by your own petard? You betcha!

    • What a stupid comment from McVey.
      Everyone wants to buy low, sell high. But this smacks of running for cover and cutting one’s losses, particularly as there doesn’t seem to be a host of potential purchasers queuing up to pay a premium for Dolittle’s share.

      • The stupid comment is Esther McVey’s speciality – she’s worked hard to get where she is today.

        • Another Fine Mess

          Not doing very well is she. Only been there 5 minutes and it’s all falling apart already. It was all running fine while Hogan was there – he said so… himself.

          • Or is she? If IDS is your role-model and you’re committed to/invested in ‘helping him to get his point across’ – there’s only one line/approach to take. She’s adopted his robotic repetition, adapted it in own inimitable style & trying to run with it for all she’s worth (not a lot, in real terms). It’s almost impossible to think how dodgy
            dave must view the two of them, what with their obvious lack of being able to make a sow’s ear look anything like a silk purse – or else he’s somehow operating them from behind – even worse. (They make a disturbing double-act; ‘scary like Stepford wives’).

      • Mc Vey talks of the unemmployed as if they are nothing more than commodities to be shuffled about by workfare providers or dictatorial decision makers at the dwp.
        The unemployed have rights and it is time they started exercising them, how this lot have got away with altering the conditions and benefits of the welfare state in the first place without being brought up for fraud against the taxpayers that are paying into the system for those in need of it is beyond me.
        There was never a mandate for this or Blairs government to treat the unemployed with disdain, threats and sanctions, nor to spend millions of tax payers money on failing work providers. Enough is enough and these corrupt, corporations need kicking out of the picture altogether along with this government.

  17. If you miss the file on 4 programme you can get it here
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/podcasts/series/fileon4

  18. When such a massive company such as Deloitte (Ingeus) quits something as equally massive as the Work Programme it will only be a matter of time before the other players start pulling out, as it instantly raises the serious concerns regarding it’s continued viability.

    The Work Programme now has a major stench of death about it and the providers are not fools, if it starts to cost them money, they will part company with the DWP in a heartbeat.

  19. Alot of the adverts on Universal job match seem dodgy, Loads of adverts for self employed door to door sales. I got a reply from somebody asking me to meet them in Weatherspoons.

  20. Just been listening to McFake’s excuses on the Radio 4 programme about the Waste of Time Programme- have to say that there was a distinct nervousness in her voice perhaps giving away that, despite her bluster, she knows that the Programme is not viable.

    • Landless Peasant

      Yes, completely unconvincing. It’s fucked and she knows it.

    • Another Fine Mess

      Good programme, lots of evidence confirming (to the masses) what a scam it is, and how right we all are.

    • McVey is the most stupidiest of women – She just can’t admit that these private providers have seen the way it’s going, (no more referral fees as of april) that’s why they are pulling out, and thats where they made millions.

    • Even those that have found employment while on the work programme and probably under their own steam, are relegated back to the dole queue after a limited time in employment.
      The fact that the prime contractors are taking the £600 fee then delegating the work to local charities and community organisations to find work for the unemployed for a fraction of what the prime contractors get paid, is one big fiddle for Ingeus etc.

  21. Don’t worry too much about Deloitte quitting workfare… Deloitte Ingeus are taking up curing the sick and disabled instead

    http://www.latentexistence.me.uk/dwp-to-force-sick-people-to-talk-to-their-own-healthcare-professionals/

  22. Sent from Samsung Mobile

  23. i had to phone the provider near 10 times to put in a complaint against them parking me for the hole 2 years and had the phone put down on me 9 times over 2 weeks.

    had to reg it with customer service as there was no complaints department but now have a ref number so just waiting for them to reply in righting within the 8 weeks.

    stupid woman on the phone said why am i complaining if i never had to go n said parking me for the hole 2 years and offering no help and just taking the ref fee is fraud.
    and if i never had to go why was i sanctioned 3 times for not attending an interview i could never get to as the letters come 2-3 weeks after i was meant to go and that’s what the sanctions was for.and i won them all and told the dwp on the back of all 3 of them and they done nothing about it. n dont care

    • Well McVey in the Radio 4 interview said the DWP would act ASAP if they found any wrong doing by any Private Provider – What a load of BOLLOCKS!

      • @obi how can they do that when private providers have so much influence at DWP?

      • Eric Greenwood (4727)

        You just have to look at the complaints procedure, If you have a problem with the provider you go to the provider. who will “investigate” and everything is ok.. they dont tell the government any of these complaints as nothing is ever found to be wrong when they investigate themselves..

  24. I don’t think there is anything we can do to change things. We can either comply or rebel. Or get a job.

    Yes I know that’s not helpful, but it’s the truth.

    We vent our frustration, we inform, we do the best we can in this dictatorship. But that is all we can do. Thankfully we can still do this without being imprisoned or shot.
    The people that implement all this crazy stuff know exactly what they are doing. They know how much we suffer, they know that we cannot all find jobs, they know that ir drives many of us crazy. They don’t care.

    They cannot overtly kill us, so they do all this to drive us mad.

    I have had enough. I just turn up at the jobcentre now, Just to document my experience. i take the piss, i try to appeal to any humanity that may be present in the person the other side of the desk.

    Some of them are decent people. Many aren’t.

    I am sanctioned till after christmas. Actually scrub that, I don’t expect to evr get any benefit ever again. Why? Because it’s gotten so stupid that i cannot take any of it seriously. They are expecting me to attend the JC for 10 days in a row. I wont be complying, not while I’m getting no benefit.

    I will tell them this, they wont care, so I will just tell them to continue with the sanctions. because I cannot play the game any longer.

    I just study them, document it, journalise it. I guess one day I will find a job, then i will have some money to have a life once again.

    Until then It will be stressful, i have minimal support so I’m luckier than most. But it’s tough. But to tell them exactly what i think is quite liberating.

    I will continue to be sanctioned until I find a job. I have pretty much accepted this. I’m giving the hardship route a go, but surely they wont continue to give me that. Because I am not going to comply with anything they say. If they start behaving reasonably then fair enough, but they wont. Even if you get a nice adviser for a few weeks you always seem to find yourself sat opposite a psychopath before too long.

    What;s the point of trying to appease them? I cannot even try to do that anymore. I’ve had it. I just go in there to give my signed declaration.

    For all the good that does. There is no solution, the only thing we can do is adapt and try to survive. Not easy!

    Stay strong people.

    • This is a system that is being unlawfully, fraudulently abused by our political representatives and their cronies in the name of saving money for the tax payer, I don’t for one minute think that those that are still paying into the NIC system want to see their payments be wasted on useless work providers while the unemployed starve, if they do then they are not human.

      • -It is a rollercoaster, & one that you realise as soon as you’re on it that you are risking your life as the people responsible for operating it are going to speed it up/slow it down & use it as a form of torture – only allowing you off if you agree to anything they ask – & they themselves are under threat of getting onto it themselves if they don’t continue to speed it up/slow it down until you’re thoroughly confused/sick or fall off.

        Back on the ground it does seem to be: ‘Good’ Adviser (for several weeks/even months); Bad Adviser.

        It’s almost as though there’s some rhyme or reason in the way the system has come to operate (if we accept that discombobulation/removal of money at some point is now the Advisers’ chief motive). There seems to be so many dictats in play at once, alongside an ever-changing sea of ‘new rules’ – & this is difficult from the claimant’s side of the desk but might also be near-impossible for the person sitting the other side (depending on how long they’ve been there; how they adapt to pressure; any political awareness they may/may not have and their level – & it’s sad to say this – of intelligence/vindictiveness).

        There’s been a distinct change even from one year ago (extraneous to the very many ‘supposed and factual’ increases in conditionality that have been brought in vis-a-vis “what’s excpected/reasonable”). If there were a handbook for claimants written by claimants – it would be out of date after the first fortnight – which is where FOIs to the DWP come in and the system itself with its appeals & processes, and this blog/boycott workfare etc. One Adviser can contradict the previous fortnight’s view/s and also their own statements can be completely contradictory in the space of one ‘interview’.

        There’s no doubt it’s a nasty, vindictive and inhumane process to be part of – for all involved at whatever level. If there were one of those independent enquiry-type investigations (as with the NHS/social work etc. in the past) it’d show ‘a climate of fear’/toxicity’ and ‘trying to meet targets has become ‘at the expense of’ meeting the needs of job seekers (ie. paying them/potentially offering any help/support) – all financial support is now gone/contingent. I think many, many people would be horrified and seriously shocked/disgusted if it were publically exposed – but there would also be others (DM readers & etc. ) who would say “It’s no more than they deserve” & start applying to work there …

    • Mr no u r right there. I went through the.ssystem, even putting up with awful working conditions, but I am mad my taxes are going on tormenting the unemployed…. as u say stay strong!

      • radio news just devoted a 2 line ‘space’ to announcing the numbers who’ve “lost benefit since … ” figures (I’m interested & didn’t catch the number – & this is all that anyone who’s unaware of how this is happening might potentially have to go on – (national news-wise).

        It’s given as ‘just another official government figure’ with a bland government statement endorsing what’s been done & somehow ‘legitimising’ it. Can’t mean much without giving any context unless someone wants to ‘unpick’ what they’ve just heard/already has some knowledge of how the system has come to be threatening the lives of those it’s alleging to be supporting.

        So, it’s ‘on the news’ but ‘not on the news’ both at the same time …

  25. I hope a4e are next to go. Those cunts can sink with their ship as far as I’m concerned. Utterly fraudulent thieving bastard company.

  26. Pingback: Deloitte Quit Welfare To Work: Are The Wheels F...

  27. OT.

    I knew this was coming, when the NHS goes private the same will come into force to pay for a visit to the doctors, people can’t win, they never will!!!, the top 10% want it ALL.

    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/politics/article3912171.ece

    Bit by bit by bit, they want it ALL.

    • The greed of the politicians and their policy makers is beyond belief, yet the state is paying and has paid ministerial mortgages for them completely as in the case of Osborne, yet they would steal a stake in someone’s home for the duration of their unemployment – it is they who should be unemployed for carrying out such extreme policies such as this,the bedroom tax and staking a claim on the family home for those that needed health care in the community and instead got forced into care homes.

      None of this bothers this government and their cronies they have already made their millions from the taxpayer

    • And the advice line for GPs when dealing with claimants just happens to be Atos advice line posted on DWP website

  28. Yesterday Monday 5th November 2013 I had an appointment with a group session at the Jobcentre. It was to inform us that in future on our regular signing day, we will be signing at our work programme providers offices.
    The claim will be taken by Jobcentre staff who will be based in the wppo. The claims will be taken clerically and then taken back to Jobcentre for processing. We were also given a log sheet that must be filled in and presented to the JCP staff who in turn will access your UJM account through it. It asks for your name address phone number and nino. You must also log the account [email] you gave when you registered for Government Gateway. They want everybody to be on UJM by next year

    • @ Philip, whether you are still on the work programme or have left it, you have the right to deny JCP staff access to your UJM account. Those who have left the work programme including myself have been forced under threat of sanction to set up a UJM account and upload a cv to it as well as giving them a paper copy of your cv. However, as is my right, I have denied them access to it and ticked my cv as private. I use UJM for jobsearch daily as per my jsagreement but only log in when there is a job which cannot be applied for outwith it or when I am checking for jobs saved by my advisor. (Post work programme I have to check UJM 3 times per jobsearching week to see if there are any jobs saved by my advisor, which obviously I would be compelled to apply for.) I believe they can still check when you have logged into it, and are able to blindly save jobs for you but still not get access to it if you have not consented to that access.
      Also, what is the point of making your claim at wppo and then it being taken back to the jobcentre??? More work for them of course, but more importantly more pointless hassle for claimants which is nothing to do with getting anyone into work.

      • Fellow jcp sufferer/customer,
        Not sure what is the point of transferring clerks as well as ‘customers’ to WP offices unless it’s part of ‘freeing up space’ in overcrowded JCPs & further separating out of groups of ‘job seekers’. As well as orchestrating advisers/wp having to work more closely togther (at present they don’t seem to have any respect for one another – each thinks the other is inconsistent/a waste of space – & that’s before they’ve even met …). They’ll be forced into close proximity – perhaps as a precurser to getting JCP Advisers used to the mysterious workings of private providers etc .. & us used to the idea that they’re sort of interchangeable (all responsible for the same outcomes which is to force us off benefit) – & work from the one building mainly – with certain ‘functions’ only being carried out in what are now JCP offices (perhaps they’ll become enhanced punishment/’sanctioning’ or even holding centres). Note to self: Must stop drinking such strong coffee.

    • I hope the clerks don’t get run over by a bus/sidetracked if they meet a friend/pass a coffee shop on their return journey with the confidential information on their way to ‘process’ it.

      • Shirley,
        What else could we expect from this incompetent, vindictive, scapegoating shambles of a government and their willing and not-so-willing servants.
        Technological advances in reverse, see Universal Credit shambles for similar outcome.

        • We can expect them to lose all of the signing information on the way from the WP back to the JCP s0oner or later – probably sooner – & then to, (what else?) put the blame on the wp/claimants themselves.

          In McFester’s latest terminology, “It’s [all] getting better month-on-month …”

    • “… on UJ” or dead/destitute by next year.

    • Its an interim step just prior to shifting them accounting wise over to the wppo when they close the JCp offices and make them redundant by the back door… at which time the wppo will not only get paid for “office space” but also then get paid the wages of said, no longer JCp, employees as a fee which then means the wppo can sack half of them in the name of efficiency and the gov can then state that DWP staff costs/numbers have been reduced by millions/tens of thousands… and that the private industry has created 5 thousands extra jobs… all without paying any redundancy.

      And the PCS hasnt realised this? well it seems not as they are not on strike over the unoffical transfer of stock employees.

    • This is obviously a precursor to Osborne’s Help-to-Work scheme where most participants will have their signing requirement increased TENFOLD over night, i.e., will have to visit the Jobcentre at which they are registered each and every weekday until they get a job or accept workfare.

      • Yep. They are beginning to make more space in Jobcentres to enable staff to screw people returning to them after serving a two year stretch on the Work Programme and transferring their former duty to harass claimants on the Work Programme from Jobcentres proper to Work Programme providers themselves.

  29. overburdenddonkey

    off topic
    victory in ILF appeal…http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-24834558

  30. From: Operations FOI Requests.
    Department for Work and Pensions.

    17 October 2013.

    Latest Universal Jobmatch Toolkit.

    Actively Seeking Employment.

    92. We cannot specify to a JSA claimant how they provide us with records of their jobsearch activity and Universal Jobmatch will not change this – it is not therefore possible to require JSA claimants to give DWP access to their Universal Jobmatch account.

    https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/181144/response/440922/attach/html/3/4916%20response.pdf.html

    • Santioned for fuck all

      They FOI requests are all well and good, Obi but in the real world and jobcentre plus don’t give a fuck – never mind UJM they will sanction you fro refusing access to other jobsite accounts! Yes, I know its criminal but then again the DWP IS a criminal organisation and you might win at the European Court in some time next century but in the meantime these cunts will still stop your benefit.

      • It worked for me, My adviser has given up asking for access to UJM now because last she asked me I called her manager over and he told her UJM access wasn’t required.

        • they have given themselves so many powers now that they can mess people around.they can be as awkward as they want.if this stands up under appeal is another matter by that time the damage is done.

          The system now what they are claiming to be simplified has turned into a farce,jobseekers directions/weekly signings.the social security system has been hijacked by conditionality. relabeled in the news as the american term welfare its become a victim of political abuse.

      • SanctionedFFA, you are right & it is pretty much completely erratic.

        Advisers are not all that likely to have heard of a freedom of information request to the DWP – but printed out they clearly are statements of DWP’s own policy & if – and only if – can get past the

        initial refusal/challenge & a) explain what it is, b) ask for a manager to have a look – an FOI like this can sometimes help – but there’s no guarantee which is why it’s all so criminal. If the manager insisted then the next step would (presumably, I’ve not been there yet) be a referral to Decision Maker). They could i guess but would be going against their own (leader’s) ‘rules’. FOI’s & similar info. have to be used with great care – it can all go horribly wrong – but it can anyway.

        I’ve had to repeatedly explain why I’m using UJ hardly at all (& finally managed to get it removed as a requirement on agreement) bbut this has all been very scary & has looked 50:50 on more than one occasion. Had to explain in some detail & demonstrate which other means i am using & have done this since November last year/with recently increased demands/angry interventions from a variety of different ‘advisers’ – so the history is almost irrelevant (as if every new conversation/argument is the first one). I’ve stuck with doing this because I’m more scared of using UJ than not using it
        & the foi’s have so far come back saying – there’s no policy in place yet that says the other options ‘may’ not be allowed – but the reality is we are all treated completely “individually” (which just means “as they see fit”) at every attendance – so one thing might stand one week, then not be upheld by a.n.other adviser the following time.

        It’s one long, relentless nightmare – no-one would understand the fear & loathing unless they’d been there themselves or live with someone/know someone well who’s having to sign on.

        I hope you can keep going somehow or another until money is put back again – I’m really aware this could have been me too at any time in the last 12 months (the worry’s prevented me from being able to do all I’d like to be doing & would normally do to find my next job) – which seems like shooting yourself in the foot. It’s almost become a full-time job of self-defence though & supposedly am only looking for part-time work …

  31. Flatscreen Colour TV Viewer

    Esther fucking McVey keeps appearing on BBC News defending fucking sanctions: “Jobseeker’s Allowance, there is a clue in there somewhere”. Yeah, very funny you fucking evil CUNT!!

    • Fester McVile if you please😉 lets get it into the psyche and common parlance…. if its used often enough someone on the telly will slip up in the same way Hunt the *unt was😀

      • “The clue is in the name”. Thanks a lot, Esther, We need to be constantly reminded of what it is we’re supposed to be trying to do – in case we get sidetracked by trivial concerns like not having enough to live on/having our benefits removed if an adviser is having a bad day/it’s a Friday or there’s an ‘r’ in the month.

        (We can now add patronising to nasty, viscious & unbearable-to-listen-to for more than 3 seconds at a time).

        • A voice like broken glass and a face that wouldn’t go amiss being repeatedly smashed into aforementioned broken glass.

        • From Wikipedia entry: McVey has debated at the Oxford Union and took part in Eve Ensler’s The Vagina Monologues at the Liverpool Empire Theatre.
          The job title “Minister of State for Employment” – The clue is in the job title: Employment, not demeaning endless and pointless “jobseeking activity” or slave labour disguised as “work experience” which has no chance of leading to actual paid work.
          Ms Ve Hav McVeys of making you work (for nothing) should look to her own responsibilities and try to work out what she is actually (supposed to be) paid for.

  32. Following the court ruling on independent living fund now found to be illegal by cutting it no doubt the Tory propaganda machine will step up the ‘ disabled are workshy ‘ campaign …

    • There is already yet another programme on bbc tonight “on the fiddle” looking at benefit claimants.
      When are we going to see programmes on the fidddles of the rich in their workplaces and businesses not to mention their incomes, expenses and taxes?

  33. “on the fiddle”

    Oh NO!, not another programme abut MPs and their non-taxable secret off-shore accounts and who pays into them!!!.

    • Annos

      as far as i know “on the fiddle” is about benefit claimants not rich tax dodgers.

      • guy fawkes

        I know that!. I was pointing out it should be about the biggest of all “on the fiddle” that is run from inside both Houses of Parliament.

  34. i have come from a jobcentre appointment that was supposed to be changed,the appointment sheet full of threats was altered by pen,however it was unchanged for some reason on the system.a text message was received yesterday.luckily i went.

    what makes this more of an interest the appointment was confirmed changed by two members of jobcentre staff, including the one that told me she would have called if i hadn’t attended “cancelled” appointment.

    no one can be trusted in the jobcentre,there is clear evidence attempts are being made to set people up for trouble.one of these two was a pcs official.

    • Ken:

      You have to be on the ball 24/7 when it comes to the Jobcentre and the disgusting practice of finding the most trivial of matters to sanction claimants.

      Well done on beating them this time.

  35. “Scottish National Party’s bogus anti-austerity posture”

    http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2013/10/24/snp-o24.html

  36. Pingback: Deloitte Quit Welfare To Work: Are The Wheels F...

  37. Pingback: Birmingham Trades Council » Seducing the voluntary sector: Or, never take sweeties from the men at the DWP

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