In a disappointing and sadly all too predictable move, the leadership of the PCS Union have blocked any meaningful discussion about fighting the ruthless benefit sanction regime which many of their members are now expected to administer and police.
Under draconian new rules claimants can have benefits stopped for up to three years for failing to carry out the endless requirements imposed on them by Jobcentres. Sick and disabled claimants can be sent on unlimited, unpaid work as part of the Work Programme, whilst single parents can also see benefits docked or even stopped completely.
The misery and poverty this regime has already created is without recent precedent in the UK and in truth has barely even begun. Despite ever more desperate spin from DWP ministers, these changes certainly haven’t helped anyone find a job and serve merely to punish claimants for being unemployed, disabled or unwell.
Claimant groups have long called on the PCS for action, not words, in their supposed support of benefit claimants. The union has been told, time and time again, of the all too real suffering that is being created in people’s lives due to benefit sanctions. Every plea for action has come with a full and realistic acknowledgement of what the PCS can legally and legitimately do to support claimants, along with calls for solidarity between claimants and low paid Jobcentre staff.
Many rank and file members of the union have been all too aware of the suffering which is being inflicted on the poorest and often most marginalised people in the UK. PCS workers have marched, fought and taken direct action alongside claimants to fight the shambolic and callous welfare reforms. Two motions on how the PCS as a whole could now solidify that support had been proposed at the union’s annual conference in Brighton on 20 May this year.
The motions have been excluded from the conference by the PCS leadership on the grounds that if successfully implemented they could leave the union liable to legal action. One of these motions calls for complete non-co-operation with the sanctions, which could be interpreted as a call for industrial action beyond the specifics of the law. The other motion however only calls to include the tactic of non-cooperation in “any industrial action campaign”. Not even this can be up for debate according to the leadership of the PCS.
This is despite the fact that sanctions are soon to be very much an industrial issue for the union and therefore almost certainly could be the target of legal industrial action (as has been admitted at senior level within the union). When Universal Credit is finally rolled out as many as 30% of DWP staff will be brought under the sanctions regime themselves. New measures to force those working part time to continually look for better paid jobs or longer hours could lead to Jobcentre staff having to sanction each other’s in-work benefits. It is hard to imagine a more toxic introduction to the workplace then staff being required to grass each other up because they didn’t apply for enough jobs to work somewhere else that week.
It will not just be DWP staff affected by the new rules, but part time workers across the PCS Union’s membership – along with millions of members of other trade unions. This is an issue which could rip the PCS Union apart unless action is taken, yet the leadership want to sweep any debate under the carpet.
Claimants and public sector workers alike should now lobby at all levels to demand the PCS take the nightmare of benefit sanctions seriously. For many claimants it is already too late. The tragic lack of real action so far begs the question at what point will the PCS leadership say enough is enough? Just how much are they prepared to allow unemployed and disabled people be abused before they decide to act and say not in our name?
Most decent people might have assumed that forced work for sick and disabled claimants would have been the point at which the union made a stand. But it seems that not even this regime being inflicted on their own members is enough to allow it to be discussed at their annual conference.
The Civil Service Rank and File Network are discussing holding a rally outside the PCS Conference and have said that if the if the PCS leadership continue to refuse to act then claimants and others should help enforce an unofficial rank-and-file boycott of sanctions.
The PCS Union are on facebook and twitter @pcs_union. Contact them if you want them to reverse this decision and allow the motions to be presented.
Follow me on twitter @johnnyvoid
No surprise there then. Gutless fuckers. Waiting for Union bosses to lead a fightback is an exercise in total futility.
@JV i guess we are on our own now…
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Though it would be a victory for divide and rule to say this: fuck the PCS if this is their attitude.
What else can I say? If they won’t stand up for what is right while their staff are being forced to do this then fuck them.
@ghost whistler, yeah fuck ’em… and fuck the fucking fuckers who fucking fucked up this fucking country, the fucking bankers and the fucking tories fucking fuck them all, the fucking fuckers..
Wow, all this fucking, where do I sign up
~bob, not pheasant pluckers; nor pheasant plucker’s sons.
lets hope all the fucking jobcentre advisers lose their fucking jobs, they dont give a fuck about us, so why the fuck should we help them to keep their jobs, to fucking sanction us. i say fuck them
yeah fucking whatever..
Meant to add this, below is the statement from the Bootle CSRF
The following is being put as an emergency motion to Bootle Taxes Branch’s mandating meeting. I would urge members in other branches to move the same where possible. Background as to why this is necessary and the original motion referred to in the emergency motion can be seen in the attached link.
EMERGENCY MOTION TO NATIONAL CONFERENCE
This Annual Delegate Conference notes supplementary rule 6.22(g) which states that the Standing Orders Committee shall “Exclude any motion which the Standing Orders Committee consider (after taking written legal advice) may provide grounds for any legal proceedings against the Union or any of its officers or agents or printers.”
Conference’s attention is drawn to the fact that this rule was invoked to exclude two motions from the order this year, both on the subject of welfare reform. Specifically, both motions called for PCS members to engage in non-cooperation with the government’s benefit sanction regime.
Conference should note that the legal advice provided stated that this could give the government material grounds for an injunction against strike action as such action would be explicitly political and not in furtherance of a trade dispute, as required by the law.
However, Conference needs also to be aware that – though affirming an explicit, political opposition to sanctions – the first of these two motions instructed the NEC to “include in any industrial action campaign” the tactic of non-cooperation. Thus, whilst drawing upon a broader principle, such action would still decisively be used only as part of a lawful trade dispute.
The second motion “instructs the NEC to initiate a policy of non-cooperation,” which is perhaps harder to argue. However, Conference notes that the specifics of how such a policy would be initiated are not listed and would be up for debate.
Conference is of the view that resorting immediately to excluding these motions from debate entirely is a disgrace. Especially in a climate where PCS members are called upon to implement sanctions at an increasing rate and coming into conflict with the unemployed as a result of it. A refusal to even discuss the issue makes it harder to protect members from hostility or convincingly argue that they are “just doing their job” and not culpable for its effects.
Conference therefore instructs the National Executive Committee to investigate as a matter of urgency how PCS might initiate a campaign of non-cooperation without falling foul of the anti-union laws.
This should be inclusive of, but not limited to:
• Emphasising the discretion Job Centre Plus staff have in implementing sanctions and providing every possible support to those who use said discretion to avoid sanctioning;
• Utilising the tactic of non-cooperation as an action short of strike in all national disputes;
• Making an industrial case against sanctions based on it putting members in harms’ way;
• Opposing the situation likely to arise under Universal Credit whereby Job Centre Plus staff may be forced to sanction their own colleagues.
Upon finding it possible to lawfully not cooperate with sanctions, the NEC is instructed to incorporate this fact into the ongoing national campaign over jobs, pay, pensions and terms and conditions. The NEC also instructed to provide support to the DWP GEC so that similar action can be engaged at Group level.
Conference further instructs the NEC to establish an unemployed workers’ section of the union. This section should be organised with the express aim of building greater unity between workers and the unemployed and of supporting direct action in defence of their collective interests.
Unity and solidarity with claimants should be practical, not just theoretical: http://libcom.org/blog/unity-solidarity-claimants-should-be-practical-not-just-theoretical-11022013
…both motions called for PCS members to engage in non-cooperation with the government’s benefit sanction regime.
OK then what about strictly enforcing the sanction regime, this would collapse the system and end the war of attrition against claimants, attrition that isolates and culls claimants one by one.
A total collapse of the system would galvanize claimant opposition and alert the wider population to the true consequences of welfare reform.
Unfortunately, there are too many jobcentre staff who enjoy making claimants’ lives a misery. Not all of them, of course. But quite a few.
You are spot on there. I was hauled in less than 2 weeks after 2nd major op to be interrogated if i intended to return to work. Once the woman established I am a high earner the fervour was obscene relishing the fact I worked for CpS and was beside herself at thought of prosecuting people. Luckily it was dodgy unregistered companies in line for the stand not some poor sod with most. Disgusted me. Still does. Can see a whole load of trouble from desperate people on the way. Bad times.
I agree. Lots of people are on power trips at the jobcentre. I don’t allow them to talk to me like shit, then the sanction threats start! I’ve given up even trying to converse with them now. Yes and no answers are all they get and if they ask about my job search I tell them to read my fucking job log.
@PCS good, you tell them …you are paying their wages so if they sanction you then….just confuse them with logic the cant cope with that
Too True. I have one of these jobcentre scumbags living in my street. Despite having signed me on a couple of times, she passes me by in the street without any sort of acknowledgement. I tried smiling and saying hello once, but she merely sneered and turned her head away.
It’ll serve them right when jobcentres are privatised vis-a-vis the situation in the US, and staff are stripped of their perks (early retirement, longer holidays and more job security relative to the private sector, etc).
And if gods forbid were her house to suddenly burn down?
She must be popular in the neighbourhood – like a paedophile in a creche.
Mine has been working very hard today to get his free easter egg prize …
@R33 reminds me of those animal experiments where animals got reward by pressing the right buttons..
As I came home from the humiliation centre today, I saw a big advertisement hoarding saying: Britain’s Rich List celebrating 25 years, with a big picture of “Lord” Sugar looking smug. So, not only do they want to impoverish us, take away our rights and dismantle our welfare state using the crisis they created as an excuse, they also then have the nerve to ostentatiously display and celebrate their ever increasing wealth – rubbing salt into our wounds and expect us to celebrate it too!
@R33 to add to that..this year BEST DEBT COLLECTION AGENCY AWARD…CEREMONY
BEST PAYMENT CARD AWARD CEREMONY..
Blatant self-interest here, none of them want to rock the boat lest they end up on the other side of the desk. Nowadays it seems to be only a certain type of sadist who’s employed as a job centre “adviser”, pleasant, helpful ones are becoming a dying breed.Maybe once they end up having to sanction each other will it dawn on them the cruelty of the current regime at the DWP, but I won’t hold my breath.
That’s a shame as I was talking to PCS members at the Amnesty AGM, and they are against the sanctions and think it’s appalling. They also confirmed that it’s true there are league tables between job centers and they are encouraged to try and sanction more people if another job center is “beating” them.
“…if the PCS leadership continue to refuse to act then claimants and others should help enforce an unofficial rank-and-file boycott of sanctions.”
And how are claimants supposed to help enforce a boycott of sanctions, according to the CSRF? Many will be too busy shoplifting, having already been sanctioned.
A nailgun might help enforce it
JV perhaps in the absence on the LAW taking on cases of this governments discrimination of the unemployed and sick, perhaps you could offer them some researched knowledge as to how to represent themselves and take their cases to the European Courts to see if they get a just outcome, before our human rights laws are repatriated.
EVERYONE DESERVES THE RIGHT TO ACQUIRE JUSTICE WITH OR WITHOUT THE LEGAL PROFESSIONS HELP.
PS Unions are only there to collect weekly subs not represent their members, if they were then why are whistleblowing nurses not getting the help and support of their union?
Nice of you to come on here and impart yet more shit the pcs union and job centres are engaged in against the unemployed.
Liberty and Amnesty international feather bedding these so called charity workers with high salaries and low results for victims.
Whilst it may well be that the union would be entering uncharted territory if they operated a policy of non-cooperation regarding sanctions, and they may well leave themselves open to legal action, it is none the less the only decent, moral thing to do. Removing someone’s sole means of support is tantamount to condemning them to death through starvation. Do PCS members really want to go down in history as a mild form of the kind of individual who guarded the nazi deathcamps. What the hell are the leadership of the PCS playing at? Of course it’s bloody political, everything is political if it involves human beings, as Gramsci pointed out, and as any anarchist would instinctively tell you – there is never any separation.
But, what can you expect of a union leader like Mark Serwotka, who when he stood as a candidate in the election for the position of General Secretary in 2000 that he’d only accept the average pay of a civil servant. According to Wikipedia, in 2011 his total salary was £126,258, including pension contributions.
Perhaps it’s time for PCS members to consider hedging their bets, union wise and become ‘dual-carders’ and also join the IWW where they themselves are the leadership. More and more workers are starting to do this as they increasingly become aware that the mainstream unions are totally supine company stooges. There are some really good people in the mainstream unions, ordinary members and shop stewards, but they are constantly let down by overpaid leaderships who are craven.
Things will no doubt begin to change once UC comes in, and it is PCS members beginning to sanction fellow members. It will get very nasty indeed, but sadly in many ways this is what it will take to wake them up.
I just hope that those really nasty JCP advisors who just can’t wait for the extreme sanctions regime to kick in also suddenly develop an enchanted life, because I believe they’re going to need it with the number of disgruntled, sanctioned people that will be around.
Do you really believe job centre workers will sanction other job centre workers I doubt that very much.
As for unions when I told the men what was going on in the offices between union leaders, shop stewards and business execs, the men went out on unofficial strike, obviously I got the sack as I was the only other person in the meeting at the time who could have told the men how they were being sold down the river.
I’m too old, nor have I ever had designs on rising to the top of anything but I have always had and always will have fight in me to rise against corrupt liars and injustice.
Does anyone seriously believe that PCS members will ACTUALLY start sanctioning each other without covering up that they WON’T? Oh they may sanction the odd office knobhead that nobody likes..But..Birds of a Feather..etc..
Just wait until the PCS come out on strike over pay/holidays/hours and LOOK for active support from the working man…and lets all apply for THEIR jobs instead..feckless fuckers..
I found out the hard way that PCS’s words about fighting the benefit reforms are not backed up by actions. They set the police on me for campaigning against the Wefare reforms:
Loony lefty – why do you choose to call yourself looney, a derogatory term given by those on the right.
Stephen Bee – take the job in the job centre and write a cheque to all of those that have been sanctioned because God only knows where these ill gotten gains went.
@gu fawkes why do you call yourself guy fawkes a derogator name for a cloth human facsimile only to be burnt on a fire..
@guy…Will do m8..I’ll try and find the computer code for charging to their ‘slush fund’…hopefully it will link back to IDS at DWP Headquarters…and then he may be forced to live on £53 a week…:-))
@stephen bee ”we used to dream of living on £53 pw” (apologies to messrs python (monty DFC and BAR)…
Our mum and dad used to kill us and dance on our graves.
We used to have it hard. We lived in a lake and had to get up at 3am and clean the lake.
We had to live in the road and lick ‘t road clean wi’t tongue.
We all lived in a hole in the ground.
Luxury – we used to dream of living in a hole in the ground.
The often missed part of the joke is that the 4 Yorkshiremen are in the South of France or Caribbean drinking expensive wine, it is also a bit of a dig at ‘champagne socialists’.
@something survived 4 yorkshiremen sketch written by Tim Brooke Taylor and Marty Feldman..yes it precended monty python..sketch appeared on ‘at last the 1948 show’
@something survived 4 yorkshire men sketch
Yes I know about it being older, it did not start onPython.
@something survived earliest records of this sketch were found on babylonian clay tablets written with betting shop pens..mass produced by KGB in a factory found on mars.
Said the scarecrow from the wizard of oz.
heres a weird though: what if one day harry corbett woke up one day and realised sooty and sweep were really his own hands..
He’d have a job on, he’s dead.
@NATS yeah i know but they overlooked this genetic defect..it means his son cant have a proper J arthur…
It gives a whole new slant on beastiality.
Go to a search engine and type in ‘furry’. If you don’t yet know what that is, I’ll let you find out for yourself.
@something survived http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Furry_fandom
Reblogged this on Teesside Solidarity Movement.
Is he any relation to the Harry H Corbett from step-TOE.?
@guy fawkes he wasnt nor did he have a hand in it or neither did he finger anyone
I wonder what the PCS union would have to say if jobcentre staff were throwing claimants into a dungeon and leaving them there without food. 30 days into the incarceration they will have died of starvation. The only difference is that claimants are being sent home to die whilst jobcentre staff gleefully rub their hands and absolve themselves of all responsibility for the executions they have carried out.
@MAGS contributory negligence you are unemployed because you have put yourself in that position.. thats how they think..using that logic you deserve to be robbed or killed because of bad decisions you made that placed you in that situation..
“Under the terms of the Job Seeker’s Agreement (section 22.214.171.124) DWP/JCP are entitled to cancel all benefit monies (without notice) if a doubt raised later results in a sanction being upheld (for up to and including 3-years) if a failure to comply with any/all reasonable demands/jump fast enough through burning hoops is found to have occurred. In the event of death* at any time during the sanction period (for any reason, but most likely privation) any and all outstanding N.I. contributions that remain can be reclaimed and as many Easter eggs as possible will be bought (milk & plain). These should be passed to relevant decision-making teams following a permanent off-flow increase.”
*apologies in advance for any inconvenience caused – extra paperwork to be completed/extraneous calorie management.
signed ……. date ………
You just have to read the tale of the vice chair of a Welsh disabled union as commented on by loony left to know what traitors not only the pcs union is but her own disabled union that sacked her. Keep up the good fight
Dr Liza van zyl – I just hope you are not a doctor of psychiatry.
Instead of using satire to depress these people further, how about putting on your research head something you are really good at and find them some practical solutions with reference to self representation to our courts or eu human rights law, regarding the way the sick and unemployed have been unfairly discriminated gainst and demeaned in the press. I asked jv but got not reply. I would if I had the time or full access to computer.
@guy fawkes if you only knew the siuation i’m in you’d understand why i need to take pressure off myself sometimes.. having said that you are right to degree as disability rights is partly why i contribute ..having been on receiving end of nastiness and read of many others who hace been discriminated against i have a lot of sympathy..the current govt wants to ditcg rights for many people..whilst claiming to help them..which is a subterfuge to push through policies that favour their business cronies..but i shall delve and see what i can find..btw thanks for the ‘nudge’ 🙂
THE POLITICS OF WELFARE for anyone who is interested..
WELFARE REFORM PAIN BUT NO GAIN
“In London, the population is more diverse and mobile, and doesn’t have the same community support as exists in other parts of Britain,’ he says.
‘Just about all our patients with severe and enduring mental illness have had their benefits stopped at one point. They’ve won on appeal, but it’s destabilising.
‘You have someone who is living independently and keeping reasonably well; then they lose their benefits or their DLA (disability living allowance) and it destabilises them, and has an impact on their physical and mental health.
‘Then they come to us. They come to us for certification because they’ve been told they need certificates for their appeals.’
Staff cuts have taken their toll, too, he adds: ‘Due to cutbacks, our PCT has stopped funding benefits advice officers in the practice. They did tremendous work and really knew their stuff. I used to have a pretty good handle on the benefits system, but now it’s as much a puzzlement to me as it is to patients.’”
“The only winners are private firms, he says: ‘The vast majority [of individuals affected by negative benefits decisions] succeed on appeal, so it causes great upset and makes money for the private companies who are crunching these people through the system — and it’s unnecessary.”
‘Attack on the poor’
‘In my view, it’s an attack on the poor. Patients become unwell during the period of their appeals, so we see them more often. They are anxious and scared. What we’re not seeing is people coming off benefits and finding jobs the next day. Quite the opposite; we’re seeing people lose jobs.’
Many fear things will only get worse with the introduction of PIP.
According to an official impact assessment, the switch from DLA to PIP will lead to around half a million fewer claimants and save £2.24bn a year in benefits payments.
“The final details have not yet been drawn up, but it is likely that those currently claiming DLA (worth up to £120 per week) will have face-to-face assessments, followed by regular reassessments. Among those likely to be carrying out these is Atos Origin.” (KERCHING!!)
Rush to save
It fears that the full impact on disabled people and the associated costs to the government are being ignored in the rush to save 20 per cent in overall DLA expenditure by 2015/16.
Before the merger, Disability Alliance conducted a survey of DLA recipients and carers; 16 per cent of respondents said they thought they would become more reliant on the NHS as a result of welfare reforms.
AND NOW WE ARE HEARING SHIT ABOUT NHS RATIONING NOW ARENT WE..MAYBE BECAUSE THE TORIES ARE LETTING THE PRIVATE HEALTH COMPANIES TAKE OVER WHERE THEY WILL CHERRY PICK EASIER PATIENTS TO TREAT..SO BASICALLY ATOS AND OTHERS ARE BEING USED TO MAKE IT ALL NICE AND LUCRATIVE FOR THE PRIVATE HEALTH BODS..but it wont save money because the private health companies will submit nice fat bills for HMG to pay up..even for minor ie easier treatments..
never mind the poor and sick can rot away or to depict them as idle and workshy..then you will get ”why should we pay for these loafers to get free health care”..
the drone public is being softened up to get robbed..
‘Despite requests, [the] DWP has not outlined how the government has worked to ensure one department does not act in a silo and ignore costs to the Department of Health budget as a result of DLA plans,’ a Disability Alliance report says. Disability Rights UK estimates that the new assessment process will create direct costs for the NHS.
What i would like to know is where all this money goes to when people are sanctioned we are told by dwp that over £130 million was taken from illegal sanctions just through that illegal workforce programme they wouldnt give it back to claiments so what happened to it who got it
@catwoman thats a good question one would speculate that is got forwarded to tax avoiders and poverty pimp trade..in fact we were told that wp providers that underperformed should be ‘sanctioned’ did they return their ill gotten gains? it would be good to see the remit of their contracts and see if there was a get out clause..i iwonder if there is something in the public accounts commitees report in the failed wp providers..
@guy fawkes as i had posted earlier a while back there ere quite a few studies i looked at and reports and books..one was ‘policing the workshy- using benefit controls’ also stuff from the joseph rowntree foundation and some others..ones i read that claimed being tougher worked were too simplistic and were based on economies that were not in the shit as we are now, so pointless in fact..
Conservatives believe in the importance of social order. This is reflected in a respect for tradition, an emphasis on the importance of religion, and a stress on the importance of inequality – such as inequalities of class or caste – as the basis for structured social relationships. Welfare is a secondary issue, but the kinds of concerns which conservatives have are likely to impose restraints on welfare, with a particular emphasis on traditional values in work, the family, and nationhood. Welfare does raise concern where it is seen to have implications for public order – one British conservative commented, in commending the Beveridge report, that “if you do not give the people social reform they are going to give you revolution.”
oops we cant have that now can we? not in dear old blighty
We have to rely on ourself’s the county elections are round the corner all wanting our vote,lets tell them what we think and how they could help us.
these people are standing for local elections but are connected to their party of choice. If we are silent we won’t be able to say i asked you etc.
And please vote get them out of local politics this is the only way for us to have a inpact.
One voice/vote isn’t enough lets make racket!
@GUY FAWKES THIS IS JUST FOR YOU OK?
this is to do with northern ireland but…..
“Universal Credit provides a good example of the need for detail to determine the extent to which the legislation is human rights compatible. As it is currently drafted, the Welfare Reform Bill creates additional conditions with which claimants must comply to remain eligible for Universal Credit, accompanied by a series of sanctions that remove a claimant’s entitlement to benefit where they have failed to meet some of these conditions. The sanctions are to be imposed where there is “no good reason” for the failure to comply with conditions and these range from a disqualification from benefits for 7 days for minor failures, to 3 years for more serious failures.
In its scrutiny of the Welfare Reform Act 2012, the Joint Committee on Human Rights (see here) raised concerns that the sanctions could lead to the destitution of claimants under Article 3 ECHR if the claimant was incapable of work. It is not possible to determine if hardship provisions would alleviate this concern given that the Regulations determining hardship criteria are not yet published, although hardship provisions are generally restricted to particular categories of claimants (such as those who are pregnant). If this remains the case for Universal Credit sanctions there will remain categories of claimants unable to rely on hardship criteria to protect themselves from destitution. The sanctions regime under the Welfare Reform Bill is considerably more punitive than the current regime, and it is not clear the extent to which this more punitive approach is proportionate to the behaviour being sanctioned. This approach raises concerns about respect for a range of human rights (see the NIHRC submission on the Bill here).”
HAPPY NOW?….from your ‘right wing’ nazi lovin fellow commenteer..blah blah…er blah..
@bob – that’s really good and says everything we need to know (in case there was any doubt) sort of thing.
@shirleynott THANK YOU !! and yet according to some (naming no names but you know who you are) it was just ‘right wing crap..???oh well,,again shirleynott THANK YOU..
That’s okay, it helps to know someone, somewhere is writing this. If only it was going to relevant decision makers & they were at all bothered.
@shirleynott no it doesnt fit in with their ‘business model’ the human element NEVER comes into it..
I’d just love to see the mini Hitlers in the Joke Centre having to sanction each other. Just picture it, “Oh I think I’ll sanction Carole on the next desk. She nicked my stapler last week and I fancy her boyfriend” ….
PCS members wanted non-cooperation with sanctions, that’s why motions were submitted, it’s the Bureaucrats that have blocked it. So the vitriol and anger at members is disgusting and misguided. Many are low paid on benefits themselves, many have left because of the vile culture they work under, if you are sick or disabled then ATOS are used to sack people, behaviours are assessed to inform Poor performance procedures and discipline up to dismissal. Yes some staff are rude and out of order but not all are Union members cos guess what there is a drive to attack union membership, recruit temps or promote the nasty people cos they fit the mold. So no we are not selfish cunts nor are we all Nazi’s as one idiot implied. The Nazi’s smashed Unions too so maybe that person is guilty of the same under their own logic. At the moment if staff boycott sanctions they will be sacked and trust me the good people wouldn’t be there if they didn’t have to be for themselves and their families (yes we are people too with illnesses, disabilities, children, elderly parents etc etc)
well said! We talk a lot re this govt turning one group of people against another. And that is what I have seen a lot of on this thread. If you have hatred direct it towards the system we live under which creates all these problems for us and not other working people or whole groups of them in the form of a union.
this bit is quite scary…BMA report cont.
RISK OF HOSPITALISATION !!!!
In addition, costs could arise as a result of people being hospitalised after losing support.
‘Many disabled people told Disability Alliance that hospitalisation would be required due to an inability to manage health needs (eg, through not being able to afford prescriptions, attend routine appointments, or cover other health-related costs),’ the alliance’s report says.
The report also warns that more discharges could be delayed if there is less support in the community to enable people with complex needs to be cared for safely at home.
Dr Bell told MSPs he was concerned about plans to pay benefits monthly, rather than weekly. He said: ‘In a significant number of families, money management towards the end of the week leads to a choice between heating or eating for perhaps two days.
‘If a family has a monthly income, they will not manage it so that they starve for two days in a week, but rather they will starve for eight days at the end of the month, and we are greatly concerned about that.’
TOO FUCKING RIGHT I THINK WE ALL ARE..except umm those ppl who rule this country by ‘divine right to rule”..and all that, doncha know..
This is what I’ve been concerned about just haven’t seen it worded in quite such black & white (and clear) terms until now.
@shirlenott AGAIN THANKS..certain ppl on here were saying what i posted was rw claptrap..??
oh btw its past 1am and ive got him upstairs playing LOUD music..ffs i get no sleep,,its on during day and night and early hours now…sheesh no wonder i am ill..
You need very good coping methods for that kind of s*** at this late h***.
@shirleynott they are all clinical mental and on meds and live in their heads and shout and laugh and just pita it means i cant complain cos they are ‘ill..but its makiing me ill..
SHAME OF A NATION DWP STOPS BENEFIT FOR WOMAN SEVERLEY ILL…
o/t sorry but who bombed boston??
I think this article is being rather harsh re PCS? Sanctions should be tackled by all of the TUC. If PCS entered into industrial action outside the law then they’d stand to lose all the money of their members. Many members would probably not be up for this particular fight and would probably break a strike or not go along with the action anyway. I personally think that Mark Serwotka would be thrilled to bits if he felt his members would be up for this type of action! So I think the way to go is to join Unite The Union as a community member and agitate within this union for some sort of action? For anything to make an impact there needs to be a huge ground swell of opinion. We need postal workers refusing to deliver DWP mail. We need IT people refusing to sort out computer stuff etc. All that would have to start at the TUC after 1000’s of Unite community members shout loud enough for it?
Yes, we need a national General Strike.
@sue brock as much as we hate those little brown envelopes coming through our door, we still need them..to know wtf they are telling us..cuts, increases too oddly enough…the huge step and im mean huge step..is for the comfortable to realize that clobbering us lot..especially the ”strivers” they ould well be next..economic downturn is a domino effect..no money to buy stuff->companies cut and sack staff..on and on..
@Guy Fawkes – no worries, my doctorate is in astrophysics, not psychiatry, lol!
I call myself “Loony Lefty” because those in PCS who set the police on me for campaigning against the Welfare reforms try to justify doing so on grounds that I was a dangerous lunatic putting their members at risk. I have a mental health condition (clinical depression) but I’m not unhinged or mentally unstable. And certainly not a risk to PCS members or anyone else! “Loony Lefty” is ironic.
@loony lefty i’m all for irony (some people dont get it) ‘diary of a benefit scrounger’ is another popular blog ..i still find it wierd that after all this time tory tpes used the excuse of THE LEFT or that well worn out 80s sun reader cliche ‘the loony left’ odd too since whilst hey were banging that crap out dear old JAMMY SERVILE was abusing kids on their watch and not a peep out of ruperts rags..strange that…
What are you providing us with here right wing crap on the workshy, conservatism and mental health, nothing on discrimination law or welfare rights, EU human rights or self legal representation to the law, whose side are you on, you tend to trawl lots of right wing sites, newspapers, magazines and dwp tripe that they are trying to inculcate us with.
@guy fawkes i cant help you mate…sorry but ive tried…
(1) document about politics of welfare (see link) which (IF YOU BOTHERED TO FUCKING READ that had ALL OTHER VIEWS AS WELL) i highlighted the conservative view..NOT to support it..
but to give insight into their fucked up views.
OH what else??? FUCKING HELL the BMA REPORT OF ER..DISABILITY RIGHTS CONCERNS…..and extracts from W.HO. docs…
FFS GUY PUT YOUR READING GLASSES ON!!!!!..and quit being paranoid..they are only out to get you after you’re dead..jeeeeez…
Reblogged this on Loony Lefty and commented:
What do you expect from a trade union which sets the police on disabled campaigners fighting the welfare reforms killing 73 people a week?
This is a horrible disappointment. I always thought Serwotka was ‘good on claimants’, but this was on the basis of speeches at rallies. Seems he can’t or won’t walk the walk. The PCS stand divides the working class and the whole anti-austerity movement — how can they expect claimants to support their strikes for more money etc., even though in itself that’s a good cause. The coalition will be rubbing their hands with glee.
The PCS is so worried about legality. Don’t they realize that the present crisis of civilization and humanity goes beyond such considerations?
At a meeting not long ago, before this happened, I suggested writing to the PCS asking that they include some kind of ‘conscience clause’ in their strike demands. It was thought that this ought to be done in a friendly fraternal spirit, rather than aggressively. Anyway, no step was taken. Now, at any rate, we’ll have to rethink tactics.
It sounds self deprecating to me and I think there is enough deprecation towards the left.
I know you are not unhinged or unstable with clinical depression and you must be happy with your diagnoses or you would be making objections now, unlike me who was given a mental health assessment for supposedly owing rent and supposedly leaving myself open to eviction which equals being deluded, you couldn’t make it up, but they did to shut me up.
I am curious were you diagnosed with this before you were betrayed by the unions?
I would like to know how abu Qatada is getting legal representation under the human rights act, who is picking up his bill? The sick/unemployed could do with his legal representation.
The type of strike action you are proposing against the dwp will only work to the detriment of benefit claimants and will not exactly bring the country to a standstill, it’s about time mz o’grady of the TUC got her finger out.
@GF legal aid cut for the poor
We know how legal aid is cut that is why WE HAVE TO REPRESENT OURSELVES. The so called dial a solicitors are on the make just for asking you to explain your grievance only to send you a letter saying they cannot help you, even though people do have a legitimate case, then direct you to Citizen advice bureaus which you could have done yourself anyway if they were not in favour of welfare reform. This guardian article presented to the reporter by the legal profession is a load of crap.
There is no help for the sick and unemployed legally, for gods sake I could represent myself better than any solicitor could, i’ve already shot peas through the assertions posing as facts that have been levied at me and proved public bodies incompetent liars.
@guy fawkes EXCEPT that the CITIZENS ADVICE BUREAU BUDGET HAS BEEN CUT FROM 20 MILLION TO 2 MILLION QUID..some centres have already been closed..
The legal system in this country is purely for the rich,unless of course its for criminal offences,which many of the poorest in our society,will eventually,have to make use of !
The legal system works for the government, anything that is going to be an embarrasment for them is rejected by the legal profession, that is why legal aid has been withdrawn on welfare rights cases.
At least all these government reforms appear to be working, the country has saved £300m from the deficit, out of a total budget of 1.5 Trillion. Good work or what ?
LOOKS LIKE THEY ARE FINDING WAYS TO HELP HOMELESS BY SELLING OFF CHEAP HOUSES TO LANDLORDS TO RENT OUT..if you are lucky they wont charge too much to add extras like walls and roof….
“Good work or what ?”
@R33 which what? btw whats happened to something survived of late? is he ok..hes not been on for a while..
It was good work or what so I chose what. No idea, hopefully he is ok.
@gu fawkes i dont get you i just dont..ive posted BMA stuff ‘see hospitalization” jeez thats scary..then WHO stuff then ECHR stuff on benefits in NI..what the fuck else do you want ? tap dance and juggle?
come on bob, lets see you tap dance
@pat i did that once but fell into the sink..(old joke)
Hi, UJM caused me to be spammed with 835 emails and my mail wouldn’t work as a result or even open, and the internet kept being down. So ironically it meant I couldn’t do jobsearch. Posts I tried sending here didn’t get through.
Trying to deal with the emails I now have 700 left to read, after 12 hours solid work.
I’ve had 2 crap weeks including a very crappy birthday, it’s nearly up there with the birthday where I got car sick all over myself, and the one where I had a seizure in the middle of Amsterdam and someone stole my hotel keys. Not much happened but I’d been planning to run in a race. It got cancelled and then I found an alternative race in Crewe. They were going to let me enter, then I was going to be charged a stupid amount for the train ticket. I gritted my teeth and attempted to buy it online. Nowhere would let me, though I showed the sites the trains. It then said go to the ticket office. The ticket office was not due to open till after the train left. I could get on without a ticket but risked being charged £200 to buy one.
So I couldn’t go. Afterwards I read the results and based on the times I would have made it into the top 15 finishers, so that is really annoying.
Meanwhile a friend who doesn’t know about running asked me to do the Great North Run, an ablebodied event you have to preregister for and it is long distance. I’ve been in training for my 25 mile walk/run but the weather and my health have been crap. I’ve not had time to switch over to sprint training and there has been no time to train. I’m worrying my only international race might be cancelled. Tomorrow is my next race and the following weekend is the nationals, I’m in 6 track and field athletics events and 3 non-athletics sports.
As I went home the other week after being asked to do the Great North Run, I was hungry, the house was freezing so I kept my coat on. While cooking supper I had a seizure and fell, forward, onto the cooker.
I woke up as my left arm caught fire. Luckily I had kept my thick coat on so it only took out my sleeve and minimised injuries, if I took the coat off I was wearing my best top and would have been badly burned. I’ve had no time to repair the coat yet. I smelled of burnt stuff for days. Another week I had a seizure while doing the bins and fell about 8ft straight down.
And right before my birthday I got a letter from a debt collection agency saying they wanted thousands of pounds for a debt I should never have been charged in the first place and they were saying they’d send bailiffs and take me to court in 7 days. I can’t pay; and spent a few days looking for info to fight them, but got too sick and busy to continue. I also got asked to pay for my accommodation for the nationals but I can’t afford to buy train tickets yet. Anyway I owe the accommodation for my 25-mile event £140 and the travel costs for getting there, plus extra for food.
Housemates have been hassling me worse than usual and it is stuff like shitting in the bin, pissing on the floor, refusing to flush the toilet, dropping their rubbish in the recycling. I’ve been suspended from work for several months just because I put up a festival poster against the orders of my homophobic colleague, who then became my boss. And at the moment he’s trying to have me sacked. And all my stuff is on the computer there, so I’m worried. While working on the festival somebody turned up and tried to blackmail me as well.
I’m also trying not to get evicted but have no time to do anything.Every time I do a tiny bit on one task, everything else piles up to unmanageable levels. I have to do jobsearch and work programme and jobcentre, which takes a lot of time. And I just got kicked off my new college module because ‘you don’t fit in here’.
After my crap birthday there was the Boston bomb. 374 people on the official UK athlete travel group were accounted for, 3 days later. But I had lots of people out there and so did my sister, and all of them were travelling independently. So I don’t know if any are injured or any other news. I still don’t know. My sister’s main teammate is a 3 hour runner so would have finished an hour before the bomb. But there are 4 hour runners I know too…
On Thursday night I went to a meeting and they were watching a film. I sat down but minutes later got a massive pain, exactly like how they say a heart attack feels (I used to be a first aider and had some lower level paramedic training, and at one point in the past tried to go to medical school but they didn’t want disabled people, but I kept up with the reading). This was really worrying and the pain spread everywhere and got worse till I couldn’t move for 2 hours. I made it back home but the pain got worse and worse, I stayed calm but was obviously unable to eat or drink. Or work. In the end I managed to grab some sleep but was unable to move most of the time and the pain carried on getting worse. I had clinic yesterday morning so had to walk there, and after treatment I asked for a doctor, I was out of luck. They sent me to a nurse for when I got back from college (the one that kicked me off the course). I got there and have been given painkillers, it is a very bad muscle injury to all of my back, chest, and right side. I can’t take the medicine yet, as I’ve been here trying to sort out the race and then the emails. I needed to be cleared as race-fit for the race tomorrow and the national championships. The specialist nurse wanted me to pull out of both, but: the race tomorrow would be letting everyone down as I am doing it for the victims of the Boston bombing. And I don’t want to pull out of the nationals, the top event I’m still allowed in, if I don’t go then I can’t go any more, and I need to defend my titles. They’ve tried retiring me or getting me to compete in masters/veterans, in 4 years they will be in a position to do that. To stay where I am I have to carry on winning.
I now need some sleep before going back here to do more email blitzing.
@something survived well its good to see you on here i always enjoy your wit and sympathise with your struggles well it just shows how awful the UJM really is..oh well dont wander off if thats poss..i would notice your abscense for one..
Back now: the emails got to 4000 new messages. It took over a month deleting but not reading the main spam ones – and that was working flat out. 45 left.
@murray2013 not really..1.26 trillion stored in offshore trusts which should go to HMRC..
Reblogged this on kickingthecat.
Are you for real??????
Sometimes yes sometimes no !!!!!!
As one who voted for one of these motions (it was passed unanimously at our AGM I believe) I am extremely pissed off that it has been excluded, and will be working to overcome this.
However we will not be helped by people calling us scum etc. There are certainly some unpleasant and vile people working in jobcentres, but the overwhelming majority recognise that these sanctions are brutal.
While we work to make sure that our union defends both our staff and the public, we need your help. Don’t give the managers and right wingers in the offices help by condemning us all.
Reblogged this on The Greater Fool and commented:
Utter disgrace of a Union, these people want people to support them fighting for pay and condistions but condone punitive benefit sanctions against people who’ve done nothing wrong?
most citizens advice bureau’s were giving misinformation regarding peoples rights anyway so no great loss in that respect, like a lot of organizations that were paying salaries to those at the top , the rest were working for sweet fanny adams. Some were acting as mentors for the mentally ill in hospitals with nil results too, I watched it all.
@guy fawkes i went through small claims court it went on for over a year..they kept losing my letters and charged me fees for rewriting them..
Start whistleblowing and getting action against the fascists in your office and stop following dictats from ids and we all might believe you. You need to sort your union out first if they are going against your unanimous motions, withdraw your subs.
I asked would you do some research for the benefits of claimants who have had their benefits sanctioned at present, in other words some practical help and positive feedback instead of a repetition of what the right wing press and websites are saying – everybody knows what they are saying.
Some of the ukip and right thinking people come on this site and hide behind irony, something I know plenty about if you were referring to me and satire also.
As for being paranoia that is for people who imagine the worst not for those who have experienced the worst. I
(being) should not be in the above.
A tap dance I’d love to see. Don’t ask me if what you have provided was of any use, ask those that are on here worrying about making ends meet and why nobody is helping them. Humour is helpful in some situations but I think the victims have stopped laughing while the right wing carry on.
@guy fawkes funnily enough i dont bother myself about the ‘right wing’ as others seem to do..i used to but its a waste of time as they are so pig ignorant boneheads and nothing you say will change their views..psychopaths dont do irony…dont lose sleep over those twats or you’ll get ill..
As I former member of this useless “union”, I’m not surprised at their cowardly behaviour. I had to take early retirement on health grounds back in 2005, and, now at age 61, am expecting more harrassment from these clowns.
Let’s get one thing straight I thrive on fighting those on the right and I certainly don’t lose any sleep over them. Thankyou for your concern but illness is not on my agenda, illness is what they attribute to those they want to scapegoat,
If you read your own info regarding hospitalization. Those that have been sanctioned and had their benefits stopped have been made to look as if they cannot manage money or that they are ill and need jhospitalization not that they really do, it’s more propoganda your putting out there.
So too is monthly pay if not paid in arrears. I have had jobs that were paid monthly so can manage perfectly well, I’ve been budgetting money since I was sixteen years old, so I don’t need financial advice from those who overlook the obvious i.e. you can’t pay bills until the benefit office pay you, that does not mean that you are incapable of managing money.
Our housing association will not consider you for help with bedroom tax if you do not accept THEIR help with YOUR finances, in other words they can make £71 pay rent, poll tax, food, tv licence,, phone, water bills, insurance etc in their dreams, their answer is to move you when their little help pot runs out..
Universal credit has not even come in yet and you are agreeing with the propoganda that people will not be able to manage. People will be instantly placed in a month’s worth of arrears for rent, council tax and other bills if it is paid a month in advance – and hospitalization should not be an excuse or substitute for being robbed of income.
@gu fawkes ok they will still need to see gp about forms though..and anyway theres the ECHR i tell you what i wont post anything or say anything you can regard that as rightwing..or if i make a cup of tea that will be right wing ..i best not eat or even eating will be right wing…bollocks to it…no wonder i get sick of this sometimes…not everything is actually political do you know that? oh fuck now i’m a fascist just for saying that..
why am i wasting my time on here..idk..
Second last line “……other bills if it is NOT paid a month in advance -………
Let’s face it, we are on our own. The shower of shite that rule our country, have ingrained their lies of “it’s the scroungers faults you can’t have two holidays this year” into the heads of the I’m alright Jacks who are lucky enough to have a job. It’s not the greedy banks or governments to blame for the recession and debt anymore. It’s the poor, the disabled and the sick that put this country in the shit now as far as their concerned. It’s the old adage ‘throw enough mud and it will stick’ and the spineless unions don’t give a shit. This government are laughing their arses off, whilst rubbing their hands with glee at the prospect of a sole conservative government come 2015. They will just keep on doing what their doing and making the rules up as they go along. Let’s face it, who’s going to stop them.
certainly not those that are laughing with them.
Lisa P If you tell the lie often enough, it becomes believable, its called PROPAGANDA.
Well don’t we all get it yet????? talk talk fuckiin talk that’s all it ever is….from us the people affected. People with money and power…the real players…are never goin to vote us in to the club are they…We have to kick the bloody door in .Once we ALL gets that then maybe something will change but fuck the unions,fuck the charities,fuck you mp, in fact fuck em all as that’s all we mean to any of them .If after all that is being done to this country,the welfare scam,the NHS sells off and everything else that’s being sold off, the rights of all of us being eroded, etc etc ..I can go,on BUT ŷou already know what’s being done to this country and its happening in other countries too,check out Germany’s bedroom tax policy and others ,and don’t we get it yet.WE are all fuckin peasants now….do,nothing and stay serfs or all you frequent posters on here get together and start a movement to change it.ONE step by many becomes a march by all….
The old ones are still the best.
We are becoming the 51st state of the good ol USofA,so basicslly we are all FUCKED…
@murray fucking fucked in a fucking fucked up fucking way..(am in derek and clive mode) fuck it..i will fucking hit that cnut upstairs as hes playing loud music and its doing my head in..
Do tory central office pay you as a active campaigner for their policies? You say forget about rw lw yet you constantly refer to irw on Tom pride blog,.
You strike me as someone who is not unduly affected financially by this cuts and has not suffered sanctions, so I think you should be a little more sensitive to those that criminally have been sanctioned.
You say you fight for the disabled yet are constantly calling your neighbours, are they interrupting your trigger finger on your mobile?
Stop being so hypocritical, you should join new labour they have hijacked a left wing party and subverted it to their own needs.
I don’t mind bowing to a majority of two or should that be three, but I will keep my powder dry for another time.
@guy yr powders a bit soggy mate, i am not a well person by any means, some days i havent clue wtf i am doing ..but in that haze of confusion i bump into stuff by accident that turns out to be something that ppl find something relevant..
Just been for my Work Programme appointment. We had a little chat about Thatcher’s death and Politics in general and I was in and out in 10 minutes. What a joke.
My WP Advisor just sits there going on about herself. I know all about her forthcoming nuptials.what her future husband does for a living, how much weight she lost this week. All why she slurps down her twentieth cup of tea.
Nice work if you can get it!!!
Nominate her for ‘Flake of the Year’
@something survived i know i may have mentioned this before but you really must do a blog or find a way to do a videoblog as some of your testimony is quite extraordinary and shocking and you seem to be quite articulate…ppl have suggested i produce a blog well i started one a while back but no one ever saw it..not one..so i gave up..i tried setting up wordpress but could nou understand it .i got as far as the title..it was meant to be surreal based on idiocy i saw on the net eg dumb comments on youtube..howver when i was on facebook i set up a group called WELCOME TO THE LUNATIC FRINGE..i think its still there last i heard it had over 120 members..basically i trawled the net looking for the most outrageous and extreme and stupid views i could find. eg bring back slavery and send children out t work really mad stuff if any of you are on facebook look out for it i would be still interested if its still going..
Anyhow, getting back to sanctions, I think the problem is that they seem too often to be applied to people who are actually genuinely looking for work rather than those who are just playing the system.
For example, a couple of weeks ago I encountered a particularly nasty piece of work when I went to sign on. I hadn’t been able to find much to apply for that fortnight, and had literally only applied for 6 jobs, which is the minimum my Jobseekers agreement says I need apply for.
Anyhow, the guy literally threw my jobsearch records back across the table to me and said – with a huge sneer on his face – “Is that ALL you’ve done, then?”
Could I have applied for more jobs? Yes, of course I could have. I could have applied for all those jobs I looked at that said I needed to have my own transport as the location wasn’t accessible by public transport, or the jobs that said they were looking for someone who was an advanced SAGE user, or the jobs that said they were “ideal for a school leaver” (which obviously is code for “don’t even bother thinking about applying if you’re over 20”).
Jeez, if it’s just a numbers game, I can apply for a dozen jobs a day. Of course, I won’t actually stand any realistic chance of getting them. And I could use my time far more constructively by creating tailored applications for jobs I actually have a chance of being interviewed.for. But at least I’d be keeping the little Hitlers at the Jobcentre happy…
(Oh, and I also regularly put in around 15hrs a week voluntary work. But obviously that doesn’t count for anything – if I’m claiming benefits, then it stands to reason that I’m just a lazy scummy scrounger who should be sanctioned at the first opportunity for being a parasite on society…)
That’s what your forced into doing. Basically wasting your own and Employers time by applying for Jobs you’re never going to get. But let’s face it, this Government like waste. Look how much money they waste. Just apply for the Jobs you can do and the ones you can’t. At least that way they can’t sanction you. Play them at their own game.
@lisa pottinger to them bricklayer employed as a brain surgeon makes perfect sense
Well, let’s hope the Bricklayers/Brain Surgeons, will be operating on them not us.
Who knows, they might even make some improvements.
@lisap its a numbers game..they dont care what happens to unemployed they just want the figures to show they are doing the ‘right thing’ to support their ideology..
okay then go for jobs looking to hire the opposite sex of staff, preferably in another country – ‘you said apply for everything’. Morons.
MSN have a poll today on. ‘What should the Government be doing about the number of People on Benefits’? In the lead on 29% ‘Invest in the economy to create more jobs’. At least some people get it it, and I bet they didn’t need to be Eton educated to work that one out. Although catching up in third place at 21% 1,994 nasty pieces of work think, ‘Benefit claimants should be forced to do community service’. Like the criminals we are!!!!
I was shocked when I saw the poll a few days ago. There wasn’t an option for what I wanted to say, so, I voted I think for one of the better options like’more jobs’.
Why do they (MSN) post stuff like that? And let people post on MSN sites all kinds of racist, homophobic, libellous crap? When you object to it they say they’ll sort it out, but never do.
In the spirit of the sort of ‘free speech’ (sic) they are promoting, might I suggest some other polls they could run?
-When did you stop beating your wife?
-Niggers; should they be hanged, shot, or set on fire?
-Are terrorists more Pakis or more ragheads?
-Tip spastics out of their chair: what is your favourite technique?
-Kicking gippos in the face: an activity for all the family, or just for blokes?
-Make all Jews and Muslims eat pork?
-Do you most fancy: the KKK, Aryan Nation, White Aryan Resistance, Golden Dawn, BNP, Combat 18, Westboro Baptist Church (GodHatesFags Church), Nashi (Russian fascist group), American Nazi Party, EDL….?
-When the UK adopts Uganda’s ‘Kill the Gays’ law, what is your favourite way to execute these perverts?
If the rightwing press were to do a survey, and be realistic, their poll would have to be more like:
-How many times is your shoe size bigger than your IQ?
-Were you dropped on your head or have you always been that dumb?
-How do you get help reading the Daily Mail/Express?
-Can you remember where you left your brain cell?
@something survived i would do a videoblog about THE ALIEN COMMUNIST PLOT BEHIND BETTING SHOP PENS FOUND ON PAVEMENTS”..
@something survived start every ‘expose’ with ;The Conspiracy of Silence behind…. meaning (1) no one has any idea wtf you are on about
(2) no one wants to talk to you because you are bonkers..thus ‘proving’ the conspiracy of silence..either that or the docu is all in mime..
maybe you’ll see ‘the socialist muslim benefit scrounging plot to frame Tory MPs over child abuse and tax fraud..”..or ‘how freemarket capitalism cured my dying gerbil of breathing..
So the Union is behaving in a similar manner to our ‘elected’ Government. Are they not s’pposed to represent and work for their members ?? The solution is simple. The PCS Union is unfit for purpose, therefore members, cancel your direct debits and find a proper Union to belong to.
@antony we are on our own with this
Meanwhile back on planet IDS – http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/10013943/A-million-on-benefit-capable-of-work.html
@kittycat i gave up reading that shit, its like the wrote on article then they just move the words about to make it seem like a new article..
i would call that a pre written article, to pump out when appropiate..
@kittycat they make 900,000 ppl disappear then claim a million are capable of work..and they expect ppl to believe them????
@murray the fault is with three.co.uk they have been blocking political blogs and a few other things too. tom pride found out. he wrote an item about a chinese billionaire . no doubt he didnt like that. turns out he is major shareholder in three.co.uk so thats why some blogs are blocked im guessing..btw my folks are no longer alive
@landless i hope you dont get sanctioned for being anti thatcher ie a ‘traitor’
This is the union Unite is possibly going to soak up?
That being said aren’t most unions Blairite these days? I know Dan Hodges advises one.
the GOD debate ‘the poor are poor because they are lazy and why this notion is bollocks
THERE IS SOME WEIRD SHIT GOING ON..seems that Tom Pride blog site is being flagged as spam as result of him writing about Atos..and DWP..
bangs head on desk
there is an international problem affecting all wordpress sites and facebook, I assume some kind of glitch. it is happening to all wordpress.com sites. it is nothing to do with fucking tom pride posting about atos, he’s talking out of his arse again to try and drive traffic to his blog.
@Johnny Void its not to do with wordpress its facebook !!!! DWP wankers have listed his stuff as spam..ok??? also a dwp twat boasted to him it was them wot dun it..i suggest you take it up with TP..wordpress is shit anway…blogger isnt much better
the problem is being discussed on wordpress forums around the world. it is nothing to do with the DWP. the DWP worker he falsely accused denied it, she just said she agreed with it being spam because it was misleading. she now appears to have left facebook, or set her profile to private. it is of course possible she was a troll,and I hope she was because otherwise someone who had links to anti-cuts stuff all over her profile and was quite possibly on our side has just been bullied off facebook based on a completely false allegation – which is that she somehow has managed to get thousands of wordpress sites, most of them non-political, listed as spam sites by facebook.
Tom is well aware that she denied it was her, but then that wouldnt be much of a story would it, so he’s gone ahead anyway – its fucking disgusting behavior that at best wastes everyones time and at worst might have led to someone undergoing unfair and quite extreme harassment and bullying.
here’s what the person tom is accusing said: “This is a message for Tom Pride. I did not mark your satirical link about the handheld machine used by a certain disability assessment company to classify disabled persons conditions nor did I admit to such action. I agreed with it being labelled as spam and quite rightly in my opinion. The very suggestion that a hand held device to detect disabilities is Being used at medical assessments is totally ludicrous and only adds to the mass of hysterical misinformation contained on this medium. Furthermore the threatening abuse from your followers only adds to the disinformation debarcle and highlights the panic and fear that vulnerable disabled people in the UK are experiencing on a daily basis. I hope that the proposed vindictive and malicious witch hunt to locate me is soon put to bed along with the scaremongering of vulnerable people.”
@ JV but its not spam though is it, ie unwarranted advertising or repeat posts of pushing some notion or product..also as noted satire is meant to be ironic even if somewhat crass at times..isnt atos ripe for satire? what do i know..im a just a nob head (apparently so i have been told) haha..
no, I agree its not spam, but she’s got every right to say what she said. and thats not really the point, she didnt report it as spam and she isnt responsible for Toms, mine or all of the other wordpress sites being reported as spam – despite this after Tom chose to name her she has received a huge amount of abuse including people trying to find her home address, where she works etc. this sorta shit has consequences, for real people, and she didnt even do what she is accused of.
@johnny void no i agree harassing ppl is bang out of order ive said that already..but, reading between the lines, he was alluding to the idiotic tick box atos uses which as we know is not fit for purpose..his comment wasnt meant to be taken literally..hence the word ‘satire’ of which she used in her response, and why did she not name Atos..but instead refer to it as a ‘disability assessor’..idk the details of it all but its not totally straightforward..we are talking about the dwp fer gawds sake..even FOI requests to them come back with a polite F.O none of your business..
maybe she did what he said, maybe she didnt..all the same it comes to something if you cant take the piss out of grasping multinational companies that eat uo billions of our dosh and subjects ppl to humilation all with DWP approval..
he can take the piss out of Atos though. despite a facebook glitch no-one is stopping him. his only evidence that this came from the jobcentre is his claim that one member of staff admitted it, when in fact she categorically denied it. and now loads of people are wasting their time over a non-story about DWP censoring facebook which just makes us all look stupid because on this occassion at least it isnt true. if Tom was on our side he’d put an end to it and admit his mistake. it seems hes only on his own side.
@johnny void ..it seems that 38 degrees has been spamified quite a lot..i didnt know that once an item has been marked as spam it sticks so posting it to a facebook page its detected as spam or something and you gott do the captcha thingy..most ppl cant be arsed..if campaigns are geeting spammed then thats pretty shitty..whther its glitch idk..but its true to say that govt type people wish that avaaz and 38 degrees would bugger off..
@JV “The very suggestion that a hand held device to detect disabilities is Being used at medical assessments is totally ludicrous and only adds to the mass of hysterical misinformation contained on this medium” and yet a half arsed bit of programming criticed by its author’ is okay?? why didnt she mention ATOS by name? instead of “a certain disability assessment company ” is she / was she afraid of legal shit or comeback if she mentioned them? lets face it after atos got clobbered (according to atos it was due to the misuse of their poxy logo) umm logos have been satirised for ages..the tesco one and various others…
@JV hmm thats quite odd since A; you stated that we should be on same side as the DWP staff and yet at same time attack the PCS..well the leaders at least..
having said all that..it IS true that politico blogs are being blocked by three.co.uk i know this..because i have run into this a lot of times plus they’ve admitted they are blocking them..
the other thing is this..i appreciate that you guys have a difference of opinion sure but its a fucking pain in the arse for us poor posters when you guys have a major spat or two.atm ive got outlaw at war with needleblog gojam and thats shit as the stuff thats being written about CSA is effing serious and this ”my blog is better than your blog” is fucking childish shit..and fucking boring…there thats my bit..id this shit keeps up we’ll be left at the mercy of good old MSM bollocks..i’m sure those cnuts love it when bloggers are at odds with each other..divide and rule (yeah yeah cliche)…
btw i wonder if in a parallel world theres a blog thats the opposite of this one..oh wait daily heil, torygraph sexpress..i know but i bet there is one pissing and moaning about workshy all with ‘evidence’..gained from the KGB no doubt..
Hi Johnny, Bob.
Johnny has actually been too fair on Tom as I have just hunted out the original post, and took a screenshot of the conversation in which the lady is clearly confused about the site being marked as spam. She is clearly agreeing that it should be marked as spam, but also denying it was her.
She was not boasting at all, nor did she ever admit to it. I gave Tom the benefit of the doubt, and thought he might have a point about this, at least. He didn’t. He has deliberately lied about this woman from the start.
@Ollie dont know why you are still on about this but…true she may not have boasted however..
(1) claiming that the disability detector was ludicrous (twas a joke) is not as ludicrous as the actual WCA test which has resulted in wrongful assessments of thousands upon thousands some of which are dead now.
(2) why on earth did she not name ATOS but instead referred to a ‘disability assessor? loyalty to the company or afraid of sacking??
(3) ATOS is known to have ppl in place who hunt down critiscism of itself..often with dire consequences..ag After Atos site which was brough down and had a cease and desist order served on it.
now quite why you have shown up on here i have no idea…maybe you can explain thats if by now i care..
Hi bob, I’m still on about it because it is deplorable behaviour to make this shit up – as Johnny has said – and he should not get away with these lies.
You, yourself, wanted to know if she had really boasted about it – you asked Tom, and he hasn’t really answered you. I’m showing you now that she did not, and he has lied.
I will indulge you, though.
1) In my screenshot, she clearly says “exactly it is satire” so she proves that she knows it’s satire, for a start. Yes, the WCA test is ludicrous, but that has nothing to do with the fact that Tom lied about this woman.
2) It is likely in her role as a JCP adviser that she was being careful about naming names. So “afraid of sacking” is probably correct – but what’s wrong with that? Again, it’s unrelated to Tom lying to everybody.
3) I know nothing about ‘After Atos’ but for argument’s sake: I can believe this happened. But that is not proof that it has happened again, and there is NO proof that it happened to Tom. He made it up. You do well to follow Johnny, but Tom is a liar.
The only reason I’ve shown up anywhere at all is to prove that he was lying, and his constant denial has spurred me on further. If you mean Johnny’s site specifically, I always read his blogs – but I never comment here because he never (as far as I’ve seen) talks shit like Tom has.
you suffer from some obsessive fixation with TP how long has this been going on..tell me when this started..were you abused at school?
Atos did try threaten to sue several sites, mostly over their logo being parodied. Some sites including Carer Watch were taking down by server companies because of the threats, although they are all back up now and Atos seem to have backed off (threatening people over using their logo had the predictable effect of lots more people using their logo to make parodies of the company). We know this happened, not only because some sites went off line, but also extensive written documentation emerged from between Atos’ legal department and the server companies.
@Johnny Void i know this but then theres a lot of logo spoofing anyway..and how many companies go after them?
thing is john..i know you and TP dont get on..thats your spat..
but i’m not going to take someone spamming lots of ppl on sites inc this one just to slag off a blogger and call that person a habitual liar…
also im not going to take someone browbeating me into agreeing with his shit..plus i dont like it when that person goes sniffing round my back door.
and suggesting that if he was you JV he’d ban/block me with immediate effect..now then John i have to ask myself whats this blokes game?
why is he so fucking obsessed and fixated with TP..???
I imagine that like me, he’s frustrated at several stories which have had wide coverage on social media from Tom’s site which just aren’t true. It’s nothing to do with me not liking Tom, I’ve never met him, I don’t care about his satire and I’m glad he’s started to attribute people when he uses their work. But this blog covers issues which are detrimental to claimants, and two recent stories carried by Tom, which have been untrue, have also been detrimental to claimants. The first resulted not only in wasting a lot of people’s time, but potentially grossly infringing the privacy of a severely disabled person. The second has led to a Jobcentre worker, who by all indications is on our side, being harassed and abused over something she clearly didn’t do. In both of these occasions Tom has knowingly lied to cover his mistakes. At a time when a lot of people are scared about what’s going on, and welfare reform is confusing and hard to keep track of – largely because even the DWP seem to be making it up as they go along half the time – this sort of stuff is really unhelpful. I think it’s right that people are calling the facts into question and it’s right that Ollie posted that screenshot. That doesn’t mean I’m endorsing everything Ollie said about you Bob, but you also made comments about him being abused as a child – so it cuts both ways.
@JOHN V….i dont like seeing ppl harassed ive made that clear..however..someone who claims to be on ‘our side’ would get the allusion to the WCA tests..and even laugh as the WCA is equally ludocrous and dangerous if you think about it…
next, she could have named Atos why not everyone else does?
you also are aware that the relationship between DWP is too damn close for anyones liking//eg the Atos helpline advice for GP’s that appears on DWP website…
or is atos just another outsourced provider to DWP? bit strange taking on and paying provider thats known to be either incompetent and downright lethal…
i am reserving judgement here mate, because of stuff i know about which i cant post here..
so did you go and give boris a good heckling when he showed up in catford..i missed that…damn oh well..maybe that fat flick wil be sweeping the streets before long..
so are you forming the Void party as an alternative?
just because she didn’t find something funny doesn’t mean she’s not on our side, come on. she made it quite clear she thought the post might mislead vulnerable people, now thats a fair point, not one I might necessarily agree with, but fair enough.
she was adamant that she didn’t report the post as spam. since the only evidence that Tom gave that she did was that she admitted it, then it seems pretty clear that’s bullshit.
in 8 years of blogging I can only think of a couple of cases of sites being taken offline by outside forces – the previously mentioned situation with Atos, and the police taking down the fitwatch site after the student protests. On both of these occasions there was very clear correspondence that showed what had happened and why it had happened.
the idea that facebook would suddenly add a spam warning (and thats all they did, they didnt block them) to hundreds of wordpress sites all because one Jobcentre worker reported a post on one of those sites as spam is fucking ludicrous – yet thats whats now been widely reported on blogs and social media because one blogger, who some people trusted, has lied. he’s making everyone look like a fucking idiot Bob
@JOHN V..maybe you didnt check out the david rose stuff eh?
…and you let ”ollie’ sucker you..
Ollie hasn’t suckered me Bob, I agree with him about Tom Pride, and it seems I’m not the only one: http://pridespants.tumblr.com/
He was never going to get away with this forever, he’s pissed a lot of people off who are involved in fighting welfare reforms and hopefully he might have the sense to stay off the subject or check his facts and tell the truth in future.
@JOHN V…and i guess that three.co.uk dont block some political blogs then..cos that weird because i can name some of them if you want..
no they dont, they have an adult filter which blocks access to some sites usually because of language used, for fucks sake Bob, I thought you rejected this conspiracy shit
@JOHN V…then three.co.uk filter doesnt work very well does it? do you know you can easily access hundreds if not more illustrations of child sex torture…
oh and oh dear i am offended so much by ‘language’….that three.co.uk must block it..
heres a thought for you..
if its just about bad language how come it dont block chris spiveys blog site?
you know chris its all eff and cee…
i’m not dealing with conspiracy shit.. i dont go near it..i only have to hear alex jones or icke and i run a mile…
There is no evidence that 3 block sites based on political content, and they dont even block sites, you just have to ring up and allow adult content. If some sites are blocked and some aren’t thats because no adult filtering system is perfect, just like no spam filtering system as we have just seen. speak to anyone who works with IT and they will explain it, you would expect some sites to be caught up in this kind of software. I have a good friend who works as a midwife. She spends half her time digging through her yahoo spambox for emails relating to her work because they are marked as spam due to words used to describe parts of the body. This doesnt mean yahoo are censoring midwives, it just means that no software like this is perfect and there will be sites caught up in it which aren’t intended to be.
It is classic conspiratorial thinking, making an assumption for which there is no evidence, and a perfectly reasonable explanation, to evoke the idea of a mass secret censorship project by all the mobile phone companies on behalf presumably of the government, the illuminati, or whoever is ‘pulling the strings’. The world don’t work that way.
@John Void http://www.occupythebanks.com/
i get this:
i guess that occupythebanks is adult then..
Didn’t I just explain why some sites might get caught up in a filtering system by accident. Honestly Bob, talk to anyone who works in IT, they will laugh at you for coming out with this stuff.
And that site, apart from being conspiracy garbage, has about three or four examples of why it might get caught up in adult filtering software on its front page.
how would i know? i cant see any of that shit.yet some of the vilest shit i accidently come across…and whats the adult filter doing? nowt feck all..
and a small kid can easily see that shit….well then IT people who know that stuff better sort it out…cos nothing is consistent at all..
umm oh yeah lets see what happened recently a snooping bill got shot down and 200,000 ppl signed a petition..maybe they are all sheep then..all ickey bozo sandal beardy lefties…
“Our filter has sometimes restricted more than just the adult content sites it was designed to block; it has limited access to some sites you might use everyday, like some forums”
“Because our Pay As You Go customers aren’t required to provide proof of their age, unlike Pay Monthly customers, the filter will remain in place unless they pop in to a store with proof of age or call customer services and do a quick credit/debit card check.”
really so how come they wouldnt accept my debit card as proof..and also when i signed up i gave my DOB so since they already know that why all this messing about?
i contacted three a while back and asked them why not debit card?and only credit card
erm because you maybe only 12 yrs old they said..clever eh?
did she criticise the ATOS WCA test? why didnt she name ATOS? instead of ” a disability assessor”..
because thats the words she happened to use, it doesn’t mean anything.
@JOHN V..i would name them fuck ’em…why be coy?…even if it meant losing the job..who would want a job that persecute ppl? better to be outside the system fighting for others than part of it..being shit scared of what you can say…
well maybe you would. she didn’t, that doesnt prove she’s responsible for what she’s been accused of does it?
@JVOID well i’m given up i dont know what ive done..ive been on CSA sites and for some reason am being sent hate mail..i’m a sewer rat, i’m a commie ******* knows what.. i’m in league with extremists…oh fuck, the zoo gates have been opened and they’re coming for me……
what a world, where did all this shit suddenly come from? whos got hold of my email addresses? am under attack..oh for ffs…dont need this..benn told to get orf net and stop spreading lies bout vip wallers…duh??
Yes, a satirical blogger abused me when I was young and now I hate all satirical bloggers.
No, Bob – I’m just appalled at the way he’s lied. He’s done it in the past too, but I never spoke up. Finally, I have said something and I’ll thank you not to belittle what I’m saying – especially with the abundance of evidence I have provided.
I have a valid point to make, and your defence of Tom is like some weird sort of hero worship – like he can do no wrong. But he DOES do wrong, Bob. He does it all the time. He makes shit up, and he doesn’t care about people like you believing whatever bullshit he puts out there. JV has said the same – and it’s not out of some mad blog-feud, or jealousy, or because he’s mistaken. It’s because it’s true. He is a liar.
Stop defending him. He’s not a god. He’s just some pathetic blogger who wants his view counts and a little bit of fame. He doesn’t care about you, so you shouldn’t care about him. He’s a joke.
and you are a stooge..now eff off..
Why JV lets you post here, I’ll never understand – but he is more patient a man than I. I’d have blocked you ages ago.
@ollie you just get worse by the minute…haha…incriminating yourself..
Bob, I have been patient enough with you. The fact is, you are not a very intelligent person. You are a lonely man, who spends his days posting on every blog in site, abusing anybody who disagrees with the slightest point – especially if they have disagreed with your precious Tom Pride. No matter what time of day it may be, you’ll pop up instantly whenever somebody says something on any blog – anywhere – that you dislike. I don’t know how you do it, to be honest.
How old are you? 60+? Tom is probably my age – late twenties – yet you worship his lies over your own truth.
You call me a stooge etc. – but please, why would I defend Johnny’s blog, when his subject matter is the same? Why would I follow other anti-government, anti-Atos publications? What kind of stooge would I be if I was only discrediting one single person? Your argument is dumb.
The fact is – Tom Pride is a liar. I have proven it. Johnny has proven it. It’s actually a show of kindness that I want people (like you) to be made aware of it too – but if you’re this stubborn about it, there’s no hope for you. Sod off, and get back to worshipping him.
@ollie blimey you are getting desparate..each time you post you incriminate yourself more and more…you’re bloody rubbish at this…
ollie you are a stooge and i know you are..
I’ve told you why I’m “fixated” bob – the fact you don’t accept my reasons is your problem – not mine.
I’m not browbeating you, nor have I sniffed around your backdoor. All the information I have on you is online, and was put there by you. Your name is on your Gravatar profile. Your age – I’ve seen your photo. I know you live alone because I’ve seen your G+ profile. I am not a stooge – I just do not like to see people being lied to – including you. It bothers me that you will defend a man so much, even after I’ve shown to you – without a doubt – that he is a liar.
My ultimate aim is not to “slag off a blogger” but to ensure people aren’t being lied to. The fact it is Tom doing the lying is incidental.
You have absolutely zero reason to believe my goal is anything else – you simply won’t accept what I’ve told you, because you’d rather believe the guy who does a regular blog, than the random guy from the comments. That would be fair enough – if I hadn’t shown you the evidence.
how do you know stuff about me online is true? age, name, situation, am i one person or several am i male or female?
where do live how do you know i live there or wherever i may be?
what pets do i have?
what car do i drive? what countries have i visited recently?
whats my partners name?
where do my parents live?
what subjects do i teach?
have i got a prison record?
you know fuck all..
Thanks Johnny, you’re 100% correct – that’s exactly what bothers me.
And I wouldn’t expect you to endorse my comments about bob – I am simply not as patient as you, as I said. I’m actually trying to help him and others, but getting insulted for it wound me up.
To clarify – nowhere did I suggest that Johnny should ban you, bob. I only said that I would. Johnny is not me, and he is a lot fairer than me. He’s even kept this issue with Tom on the down low, which is commendable. Had I been in Johnny’s position, I’d likely have published a post calling Tom out so that all my readers could see it. The fact JV has not shows remarkable constraint.
@ollie “To clarify – nowhere did I suggest that Johnny should ban you, bob. I only said that I would.” and why is that pray tell?
@ollie “I’m actually trying to help him” why do you think i need your ”help”?
Bob – you’re correct. I know fuck all. That was my point. I was merely explaining that I only knew those things from the web – not because I have some special info on you, or because I’m a “stooge”. So you needn’t worry.
@ollie thats why i dont believe you..
THE TALE OF BILLY WORKSHY (a story made up to support bigotry)
“Is working for five hours a day in a discount store, as Ms Reilly was requested to do, really the same as being stripped of one’s humanity on a South Carolina plantation? Rather than blame society, Ms Reilly, who’s been out of work for two years, should have thought more carefully about her degree choice, and its relevance in the jobs market.
The geology graduate might have reasonably concluded her career options were limited.
It’s not rocket science, is it? ”
REALLY FUCKWIT? geology plays a great part of things that happen.re agriculture, mining, building, etc etc…some people study philosophy..
some people study mental health so they can profit from that studying?
or to assist others, some people study nursing..presumably to increase their earnings to become millionaires? thats the thing about markets isnt it..everything is supply and demand..
the slaves in south USA were there to work for whites. Earlier convicts and indebted labourers from UK and Ireland were sent over but got sick and couldn’t do the work and some died. Triangular trade was a perfect capitalist system – and when slaves died you just replaced them. The Caribbean native peoples were enslaved, murdered, were worked to death, or died of diseases. Hardly any survived. Black Africans were shipped in to replace them. And to North America (and south).
A guy the other year calculated that the compensation due to the descendants of slaves, runs into billions or trillions of dollars. Slaves could be beaten, killed, raped. Some were executed. Some were killed by the KKK. The whole capitalist system of the time SUPPORTED slavery, after all it is more profit if your workers are not paid, can’t complain, can’t leave, can’t strike, own nothing, live in terrible conditions, and are fed nearly nothing.Operational costs go down. You don’t need to do anything for their health and safety, even less than what is done regarding white children in British factories. Best of all, if you own a female slave it is not legally rape to rape her. ‘Freed’ slaves were later thrown out to starve, could still be killed by the KKK, and were still segregated and did not have equal rights. Only in living history was it made federal law to stop discrimination, and it is still not always enforced. The KKK is not on the same government ‘page’ as Al-Qaeda, and is actually more dangerous in many ways. Southern Poverty Law Center, a human rights organisation, calls KKK and similar groups terrorist organisations.
Fascists:Not enough to tarmac a whole road with, too many to shove down an industrial meat grinder.
@JV i i see of late you’ve been spammed on here.so much for your spamguard..
oxygen theives steal air products in attempt to wreck uk economy..
UK pavements taken over by freeloaders
.in a shocking report today it was revealed that millions of pavements were being taken over by groups of illegals walking along them.a spokesman said today it was horrifying to learn that uk.pavements.plc were being criminally being trespassed by anti social elements who showed no consideration for all the hard working fee paying customers…these paedostrians had been abusing pathways for many years wearing out respectable flagstones..cheif constable Clive Bribetaker said today ”its time we cracked down on this sort of thing”..
Someone at college says her mother got called on the phone. The person said to her mother (she has senile dementia): ‘we are here with your grandchildren, and they are buying a computer. But they have run out of money or their card isn’t working. They would like you to pay them for the computer’. The person did not say who he was, why he was with the grandchildren, or their names and ages. Weird phonecall to get. A normal person would demand to speak to the children, ask who the person was and why he was with them,etc. A normal person would not suddenly buy a computer. She felt guilty and nearly gave her card details. In the end she hung up then felt more guilty. She should have asked where was another adult who looks after then, and how he got her number. Real grandchildren anyway would not suddenly demand an expensive computer from a grandparent, not in a way of really expecting to get it. If they did they’d be off the presents list. Obviously a scam.
UJM sends me tons of spam and scams every day.
@something survived i have a feeling that my next door neighbour is again dumping his belongings in the garden..he did this a few days ago and was told off..now hes doing it again..does he think the garbage fairy will take it away..i rather think they wiil take him away..hes done this before and i could not exit my room as he left stuff out in front of my door..
my housemates do this daily. they think the garbage grows legs and walks off?
they are middle class students. plus a pensioner student (fascist one), plus the alcoholic benefits one who is working while on drink/drugs while on benefits. plus all their boyfriends and girlfriends.
@johnny void this ‘ollie’ ‘person’ is now spamming everyone with this ‘TOM is a liar shit’..hes spamming all those on toms site and now here FFS sake..
Tom is a liar I’m afraid Bob, that’s been pretty clearly demonstrated, can folks on both sides please try lay off personal insults though.
@JV ok Tom is a liar then..well so am i then..yeah?
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