What Labour Said Then, What Labour Say Now And Why They Can’t Be Trusted On The Work Capability Assessment

atos_david_milibandWhat they said then …

Labour will: “increase support for claimants to return to work, replacing the old one-size-fits-all model, which writes people off as completely incapable of work, with a tailored, active system that addresses each individual’s capacity”

A new deal for welfare: Empowering people to work (PDF) – The Green Paper which proposed the Work Capability Assessment in 2006

What they say now (2014)

“We want the assessment to be part of the process of ensuring disabled people who can work get the support they need to do so, not to threaten or punish them. The test should be a gateway to identifying and assembling that support.”

How Labour would reform the Work Capability Assessment – Labour Shadow Secretary for Work and Pensions Rachel Reeves and Shadow Minister for Disabled People Kate Green

Then (2006)

“We will work with health professionals, personal advisers and disability groups (including the Disability Rights Commission and the Disability Employment Advisory Committee) to ensure that the transformed assessment process is fair and equitable in application and operation.”

Now

“We would continue to produce an independent review of the WCA, and ask the Office for Disability Issues to support an independent scrutiny group of disabled people to work together with the independent reviewer to assess whether the test is being conducted in a fair and transparent way.”

Then

“It will never be reasonable to expect some people to plan for a return to work or to impose the responsibilities and conditionality associated with this on them.  These people – who have the most severe health conditions and disabilities – will receive the new benefit without any conditionality, and at a higher rate”

Now

“We also recognise not everyone can work and we’re committed to ensuring the support’s in place for those who can’t.”

The Work Capability Assessment was designed by Labour to strip sickness and disability benefits from one million claimants. There has been no announcement that this policy aim has changed. More people are placed in the Support Group now (meaning they are not expected to look for work) than they were under Labour. Whilst the Tories and Atos are currently at war, Atos have sponsored events at the Labour Party Conference in the past.

The Labour front bench have been silent about the introduction of Personal Independence Payments – designed to strip disability benefits from a fifth of disabled people. They have not spoken a word about the heartless closure of the Independent Living Fund. They voted for Iain Duncan Smith’s backdated legislation to steal hundreds of thousands of pounds from claimants by denying them compensation for illegally sanctioned benefit claims. They support unpaid work – even when the schemes are almost certainly illegal under minimum wage laws. Labour’s Job Guarantee is just workfare plus a sandwich which in practice could be more exploitative than current workfare programmes.

They have not changed. They will not change. When not pretending to give a shit about disabled people Rachel Reeves has boasted – boasted – that she would be tougher on welfare than Iain Duncan Smith. Most of the Labour front bench are chinless posh twats just like the braying toffs they pretend to oppose. They are on the side of bosses and billionaires, not us.  Do not fucking trust them.

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236 responses to “What Labour Said Then, What Labour Say Now And Why They Can’t Be Trusted On The Work Capability Assessment

  1. Big Chief Wigwam

    Labour speak with forked tongue!

  2. Watch, his Lips are Moving!

  3. We have our Goebbels boys Brian Reade and Paul Routledge watching your treachery

  4. Brenda Barnstubble

    I wouldn’t trust blooming Labour to run a blooming whelk stall!

  5. Welfare reform should have torn the Labour Party asunder, the fact that it did not is evidence of authorship and collusion they are all in this together.

  6. Hand in hand the two Tory parties go the blue Tories on the right side and the red Tories on the eh! right side!

    Labour = Con party.

    I tweeted a member of the shadow cabinet to ask why they colluded with the Tories to change the Workfare legislation overnight.

    No reply and there won’t be any reply. They are a con, a farce, a sell out!!

    They should be ashamed to call themselves the Labour Party. That died a long time ago.

    Vote YES in September and be rid of the Tories forever. At that point the real Labour party can then start representing real working class people instead of this sham party we have at the moment who are interested in ££££ and that’s all.

    • The 30 Scottish Labour MPs Voted For Osborne’s Welfare Cap – the real Scottish Labour party.

      The ideological hostility towards social security is self-evident what will change that mind-set between the 18th and the 19th?

    • Problem is a yes vote saddles the mainland with more tories.

    • True. And because they still call themselves Labour they get votes through tradition and association of ideas in the depths of some people’s minds where Labour is still viewed as somehow just.

      As for getting a reply from a Labour MP, you’d be more likely to get a reply from a Conservative MP, seriously. I know that from experience, and from the experience of others. Labour MPs tend to group together like bison, all facing outwards in full defensive position and largely refuse to listen to anyone…. once they’ve been briefed of course.
      THEY ARE FULL OF BS.

    • Independence won’t guarantee that we’ll get rid of right-wing government (it wouldn’t be Tory in Scotland, but might be right-wing Labour a la ‘something for nothing’ Lamont). However, a No vote will guarantee that we’re stuck with Tory government forever. And with independence, combined with PR, we’ll have some influence over the type of government we get, while we have no influence whatever over the Westminster government.

      In addition, there’s a more pro-social justice, pro-welfare, pro-immigration political climate in Scotland than in England. Of course, following a Yes vote and the boost in prestige for the SNP, that party could turn around and show whatever Tory colours it has. But again, we could vote it out.

      So the referendum can’t be dismissed as just another electoral contest between parties.

  7. WCA is an entirely unnecessary waste of public money. In case the dickwads at Labour HQ had forgotten, we already have people doing work capability assessments as part of their job. They’re called doctors and they spend years studying medicine. Remember the old days where doctors could say that one of their patients was sick and they weren’t called liars by the Labour Party?

    The Labour Party decided that doctors didn’t know shit, and that rubbish physiotherapists and nurses who nobody else wanted should double-check what their academic and professional superiors had assessed, using an ass-backwards tick-box form containing questions about making cups of tea.

    I got one of those forms once and my mind melted at the sheer headfuckery of the whole thing. Suffice it to say I never got the time off to recuperate that my doctor had recommended. I’m lucky to fucking be here. Thanks, Labour!

    • It amazes me that anyone wants to vote for them they are so pathetic. With that weakling Miliband at the helm and Ed Balls talking a load of crap.

      Honestly, what a pathetic bunch of weasels. Only reason anyone would consider voting for them is because there’s hardly a decent alternative.

      • You have hit the nail on the head there, what can we vote for? Certainly not the fag smoking joker whose decimated fingernails give many clues of self esteem issues, can anyone viable please step forward and identify yourselves?

      • I’ll be voting UKIP, not because ideally they represent my views but merely the fact it’s time for a change and they are the best contender. Not to mention the fact they’ve got the Tories and Labour running scared; more than reason enough…

        • Landless Peasant

          Then you’re a fucking cretin. UKIP are Nazis, plain & simple.

          • UKIP have everyone running scared, they are a party f bigoted psychopaths

            • Ukip are not Nazi’s, for a start off they want out of europe not to take it all over for the benefit of one countries people. they are not bigoted wanting control of your own nation doesn’t make you a bigot, but wanting foreigners to run your nation from another country is treachery. Only sheeple believe the propaganda regarding how important the eussr is to our nation, the fact is only politicians benefit from it.

          • Then you’re a fucking cretin. UKIP are Nazis, plain & simple,,,,,,,,,,,,so what are the conservatives then?…..in your opinion….ffs they are killing the uk, and its people, get real mate before you call people cretins.

            • terry
              can anyone tell me is there anything wrong with writing none of the above, with a drawn in cross box next to it on the ballot paper, or leaving it blank, it will still have to be counted, even if it is counted as spoilt, it still counts…it is proved by doing this one has made the effort to turn out vote and sends a strong message of dissatisfaction with the available candidates and /or political parties….

              • Approximately a third of the electorate didn’t vote at the last general election or the one before, but like you said obd best to spoil your paper for fear of cheating.

        • i believe a lot of germans said that about hitler.

        • If people want to continue waving goodbye to the NHS and Social Security of all kinds, then people will be voting UKIP/Tory/Labour/Liberal

          For me, Labour died the day they elected Blair as leader. They have headed downhill since then. Currently, they are close to reaching terminal velocity.

          If we have a Green Party candidate, I’ll vote for them.

          Some years ago I noticed that there was a second number printed very small on voting cards. It correlates to the number on the voting slip you are given when you vote. You hand the voting card in, they check it against a list, and on this list, next to your name, is the same tiny number. This number isn’t the same alphanumeric as your place number on the electoral roll either.

          Surely it couldn’t be that voting in the UK has never been truly anonymous?

          I wonder if this means if we mess up our voting paper, we can be traced?

          • What difference will it make whether we can be traced or not, if I want to mess up my paper or not vote at all, that is up to me if there is no party that represents my views or has more negatives than positives, which appears to be most of them.
            The greens are progressive but they believe in a universal citizens income – why should the wealth get more income?

            • guy, I have no idea what difference it makes whether we can be traced or not. The point I was making, was that voting is supposed to be private, one’s own affair, not the business of anyone else or the state. Their responsibility is that we are identified as entitled to vote at the Polling Station, from then on, there should be no link. The numbers correlate between list and card, so therefore, whether we make a cross in the box or draw a great big comedy penis, the point is, it shouldn’t be linked to us as individuals.

              …and, I think a universal income would be a marvellous thing, if everyone gets it, then everyone gets it. Same as Child Benefit. Once you start piddling about with means testing, the people who have absolutely bugger all end up with even less.

              The wealthy will always be wealthy, whether they get a citizen’s income or not. For the poor, as we see with sanctions, the effect is devastating when their only means of survival is taken away or just doesn’t exist.

              I think denying a universal income as a possibility is a bit like cutting your nose off to spite your face, especially if you are poor.

              • Lucy our benefits have been drastically reduced or sanctioned so that the poorest will jump at the chance of a citizens income, the only ones that seem to be for it are those that have savings or the rich, the poor know they are going to just break even but those with money will go on a spending spree.
                There are ways to reverse the inequality in wealth and wages, but the politicians are either cowards not daring to stand up to the rich or greedy sods who want to be in the pockets of the rich, a universal income will do that for them.

                Try fighting to have all of the oppressive conditionality taken away and a decent benefit system retained without handing yet more money to the rich or those on middleclass incomes.

          • The fact is that it’s always been possible to discover who voted for whom, but the practicalities of actually doing that mean that it’d be extremely unlikely for that to happen. Maybe if votes were counted by machines it would make it easier, but so far only people are being used to count votes in UK elections.

            In countries that use electronic voting machines, like the USA, there have been questions raised about, not so much who voted for whom, but over issues of ‘fixing’ the vote. In Venezuela there were also concerns that closed source software used in voting machines could be programmed to favour some candidates/parties over another, and there was an appeal that the software used be open source which would allow proper scrutiny as code introduced to create a bias would be spotted.

            • Just like those who rule over the means of production, the ones with the means of technology are showing just how corrupt they can be also.

            • The issue of fixing the vote in the US via electronic voting machines was brilliantly sent up on the intro to an episode of The Simpsons. No I don’t know which one, but it’s worth looking out for. I have always felt that this would be a good way of sterilising all Tories – an important priority for us today, I think you’ll agree. Rig up the machines to deliver a jab of some sterilising drug through the touchpad to anyone voting for the Tory candidate and…Bob’s your uncle – a more equitable society at a stroke!Good to have you back, Sib, where ya been? This site has been sorely missing your level head!

        • Therefore you’re a Nazi fuckwad. What are you doing posting on a blog like this? Shouldn’t you be off somewhere ranting about “immigrtunz tekin’ ova der cuntri an’ steelin white manz jobz an’ havin’ braaaan babees”? Or possibly tossing one off to pictures of Germann Goering?

        • typo, that should be ‘Hermann’.

          • (oh, and that rant was in response to the person who said they were voting UKIP,, bunch of fucking rabid extreme right-wing fucks, their insane beliefs almost make some of Tories look like humans – For some reason, clicking ‘reply’ under a partcular post still shunts your comment down to the bottom).

            • Do you live in the uk? Are you an immigrant or child of an immigrant?
              Most of the working class immigrants do not want more immigration.
              It is not racist to want to look after the people already in this country.

              • Do you live in London? Are you a hard-working family or a child in a hard-working family?

                Most hard-working families in London don’t want jobshy scroungers getting money for nothing.

                It is not unfair to want to look after hard-working families in London.

                /rhetoric

                • Sarah

                  London is not the whole of the uk, they may consider the unemployed to be scroungers if not in work, but they do not speak for the whole of the country.

                  Where are the polls that show statistics for those in favour and those not in favour of mass immigration? but to be selective of immigrants is even worse and changes the voting dynamics in this country.
                  Therefore when we can accommodate migration, I would be in favour of all classes entering the uk, but not until.

                  If there is a skill shortage as all parties are trying to imply(which I doubt), where has all of the bloody public and private money for teaching, training and tuition been going.

              • The ‘no more immigration’ brigade have one thing in mind, and one thing only – They are worried that allowing ‘forin peepul’ into the country will somehow dilute the purity of their race; it stems from a deep-rooted fear of losing their ethnic identity, a baseline xenophobia ground in at the deepest level.

                All the ‘reasonable’ arguments put forward by bullyboy louts such as UKIP, BNP, EDL etc etc. (they are basically all the bloody same lot, attracting the weak-minded, the fearful and the lost) are little more than elaborate wordplays designed to obscure a mindset that is based upon pure, undiluted racism.

                We fear the unknown, unable to comprehend or cope with the notion of a community formed from people who ‘are not one of us’. UKIP, EDL and their ilk provide convenient logical-sounding articulations of these fears, safely obscured, and wrapped up within economic, or socio-economic rhetoric.

                But to coin an old phrase, a dog turd with sugar frosting is still a dog turn. Racial purity is a crock of shit, and however it’s presented, it’s still a crock of shit!

                • Racism is also wordplay, used to condemn people as xenophobic if they so much as mention they want immigration to be curbed, not indefinitely but until a time as we have sufficient jobs and housing for those already in this country.

                  As for wanting a purity of race, that is rubbish the right wing parties care not one jot whether you are black, white or orange, the only purity of race they are interested in are the ones with money.

      • My personal website home page has several parties on the left to vote for on May 22 European and Local Elections. And links for Scots to vote Yes to keep NHS free and help the vulnerable and the poor from Austerity obsessed London. Only page where you’ll find viable alternatives to mainstream parties. I have put right wing parties so page is non-partisan.
        http://www.theswansnewparty.org.uk

        • something survived...

          St. George: Turkey
          The Royal Family: Germany/Greece
          Our numbers: China via Arabia
          Our writing system: Italy
          Chips and Ketchup: the Americas
          Tobacco: the Americas
          The concept of wearing clothes: Africa or Siberia
          Curry: India
          Chewing gum, wellies, chocolate, etc.: the Americas
          Coffee: India/Arabia/Africa
          Tea: India/China
          Silk: China
          Boris Johnson: Betelgeuse
          Paper to write on: Egypt, and others
          Christianity: Palestine
          Shaving: Italy (Romans again), France/Sweden (Norman French, who were originally Swedish Vikings)
          Underpants: probably Turkey (‘women’s modesty trousers’)
          Nigel Farage: A dustbin somewhere in Essex
          English language: Germany, Denmark, France, Italy, Scandinavia, Frisia, Netherlands, Belgium, Greece, rest of world
          Concept of computers: Greece
          Most of our computers: Japan
          Plastic goods: China
          Rhinoplasty (Nose jobs): ancient India (Susruta used a flap technique of grafting to rebuild the noses of a) warriors and b) people disfigured as a punishment by having their noses cut off)
          Caesarian section: believed to have been Arabia
          Helicopters (concept): Italy
          Libraries: Egypt (that of Hypatia was one, till it got destroyed and she got killed)
          Schools: Ireland (bardic/druidic education) or Italy (Romans) or Greece
          Hospitals: started off in a big way after the Normans came over from France
          Board games: a lot originated in Africa, Arabia, India and China.
          Nick Griffin: ???????? [we haven't determined the origin point of this yet]

  8. I don’t like or trust Labour but…..who else can get the Tories out for us? The Lib Dems are traitors, UKIP are fascists, and the new parties of the left are far too small and will take decades to get enough votes to get any seats under our unfair voting system. I have to vote Labour as the other parties are even worse/ too small to make a difference.

    • Therein lies the problem Thomas. Labour are totally crap and less than useless, but are the only alternative to get these scummy creeps out.

  9. A tactical vote for UKIP just close your close your eyes and think of England. :-)

    • Landless Peasant

      UKIP are Nazis.

      • No. The Nazis were evil AND sane; UKIP isn’t sane.

        • The Nazi’s sane??????????????????????????

          • Was Hitler suffering from any mental illness or was he just evil? You don’t have to be nuts to do bad things. Some people are just like… EVIL!

            • Hannibal the Cannibal

              Yeah, like Iain Duncan Smith.. :)

              • guy fawkes | April 22, 2014 at 2:42 pm | Reply

                Yeah, like you Hannibal, he never has problems finding something to eat!

            • j g
              hitler was mentally ill/insane, caused by the affects of severe uncured child abuse… no one is born evil, that is wrath of god nonsense….also dsm 5 is crap toxic gossip http://www.soteria.freeuk.com/176_16-18.pdf
              also see the work of the late dr alice miller on hitler et al….

              • OBD you suffered abuse but you are not evil, so why should it be an excuse for Hitler? Where all of his henchmen abused?

                • g fawkes
                  “OBD you suffered abuse but you are not evil, so why should it be an excuse for Hitler? Where all of his henchmen abused?”
                  why, coz i had a “rain coat tent” where i could hide, woods to get lost in, imaginary friends to keep me company…plenty of relatives that i could visit, a wonderful disabled cousin who was always delighted to see me, many many things…kind mothers of friends, beans on toast, the odd caring teachers, knowing policeman..they all knew what was going on and never made a direct fuss of me but offered shelter, tea, cake, and a welcoming smiling face, there are those who use, abuse, and those that don’t…which is why i mourn the terrible loss of our communities…i saw people at there very worst and at their very best, i was still extremely traumatized, but it offered me hope, of a better life, recovery, and escape….i was even branded backwards when i was 7…that was my life, nothing i could do at the time to change it only endure it…i knew it was wrong, i fought it which at the time made things much much worse, but somehow i found an inner determination to overcome it and kept fighting, i was never going to let my spirit die…it was never a question of if i overcome it, but i MUST overcome it and heal, we all deserve to heal…
                  hitler lacked this in his life, as all tyrants do…i could have simply said that i had “enlightened witnesses”, but that would sound pompous, strange,
                  buddhist, but it was the ordinary milk of human kindness, that saved me…
                  ….see work of dr alice miller on hitler et al…

                • OBD

                  I’ve read enough about doctors and medical opinion, most of which changes from year to year, but the quacks, shrinks whatever you want to call them need to be gone – all of them, even the alice millers are part of the system obd.

                  If all of the people that fed you and took you in had gone and got you real help, they could have alleviated your abuse.

                  People may have been travelling for thousands of years and that may be ok for nomads and loners, but not for people with families.
                  If people have problems in their own country they should stand and fight the oppressors as we are trying to do here, not run away.

                  I was asked would I support keeping girls here that may face genital mutilation if they are deported – Do we have to take every girl child that is being subjected to this or should we send help for them to stay in their own country and change their culture and get rid of the despots and oppressors?

                  Which ever way we go the capitalist wins, because they want the third world to be educated enough to become the next port of call for the investors to exploit, or they will bring them here to make sure we are exploited.

                  Farage is taking the proverbial p out of his voters now saying he will bring in so many skilled migrants and no doubt send our skilled workforce abroad when there are no jobs for them here.
                  The man is a stirrer not a serious politician.

                • g fawkes
                  i have been very open with you, i know EXACTLY what i am talking about…
                  what do you mean real help…? that was the real help, the system was/is the main abuser, with all of the posts that have been published on this blog of abuses committed by the system, this is well established knowledge, you often post yourself about how toxic the system is…people that have not gone through the kind of abuse/trauma, that i have, often claim trails of the perpetrators bring closure and is cathartic, this is simply not true, the memories continue to haunt one, until the frozen bottled up rage, is dynamically booted out of head, with the aid of very deep psychotherapy, there are very few child/adult psychotherapists about, yes many charlatans who think that they are, the rule is let instinct be guild, if gut says stay all is well, if it says go run like hell…the “care” system, as is well reported often compounds the traumas, it deepens them….BEFORE any prosecutions are brought the victim should be healed 1st and as indeed the abuser…this would be true justice….alice miller is not part of the system at all, she openly condemned it, as does dr bob johnson, and DO offer a viable alternative…trauma is very badly treated in western countries…the trauma should always be healed 1st before any criminal proceedings, for both the victim and the abuser, the criminal proceedings would maybe not even have to take place, and only then if to learn more about why whatever happened, happened…to find out what went wrong make sure that it can never happen again law cannot cure abuse, only humanity can….no one is born evil…law should not be modified to accommodate wrath of god politics….
                  yes, lock abusers up to stop them harming others, but also offer to heal their pain as well…we end global poverty and deprivation from our own backyards…i am also a realist, and deposing/resisting tyranny by bloody violence can be the right thing to do, as the belski brothers et al did, kill or be killed…or as in the various jewish ghetto uprisings….alice miller herself escaped the polish piotrkow trybunanski ghetto, and returned to smuggle in food for her parents, she eventually managed to rescue her mother and sister her father however perished there in 1941..so i think she had some knowledge of the fascist state, don’t you…using defensive violence to
                  stop people hell bent on/in no escape ethnic cleansing is always the right thing to do….

                • OBD

                  I did not mean real help regarding social workers taking you away, I was talking about the policeman that you say knew about your circumstances not arresting the person that was abusing you, and taking them from the home and away from you.

                • ps the trouble with academia it wants loads of money for pushing a pen, not doing any worthwhile work of any substance.

                • guy, that hits the nail on the head as far as primary and secondary mh care stands in the UK. In particular, it’s CBT that has now become the main push of the pen. It does nothing except compound the very problems it’s proponants are supposed to be helping a person heal from. Worse, the approach has seeped out like leaking sewage into mainstream physical medicine too.

                  Academia is as rife with uncontested ideology as the government and the DWP. First up against the wall in my revolution – Simon Wesseey – this cigar sucking sleaze bag was the driving force for IAPT and convinced Gordon Brown’s government to implement it at the cost of all alternatives. The hard core sciency evidence shows that CBT is less helpful than staying on the waiting list. Isn’t academia wonderful? :s

                • lucy
                  “We need a new model.” the new model is available, but it destroys capitalism….the main problem is that the emotional reactions to abuse are seen as mental health problems, and not as they actually are, a normal healthy reaction to abuse distress is not a cause but a symptom..which is what bob johnson points out in http://www.soteria.freeuk.com/176_16-18.pdf arresting perpetrators cannot be done without hard evidence, the crime scene is a human being not an object, abusers take great care to traumatize victims to stop this happening…the child then has to give evidence and risks losing everything ie natural life support systems built up as a response to abuse over many years, to be put in the care system con-trolls/destroys the childs/victims integrity sense of self , self determination and judgement even more…it is easy for others to say where the child/victims will be better off,”for your own good”, but what happens should always be the childs/victims choice CONSENT, as the others are not intensely emotionally involved in the actual suffering of the abuse…care homes use “critical therapeutic interventions” when a child displays distress, to shut the child down emotionally ie shut down the childs healthy expression of healing/indigent rage, they are often drugged, to shut them up…..controlled, managed and punished for displaying the symptoms of trauma, distress..the child must always be in charge of the process, but this is often the last thing that happens…it is, we know what is best for you, no one can recover self in such circumstances…the cure always involves the victim speaking/screaming out in anguish, pain, agony, rage, of what has happened under their own steam/time, often people precursor “now in your own time” (an instruction), which actually means in theirs, as they want instant controlled recall at that moment ie within the next 5 mins there whole body language displays impatience/aggression “we haven’t got time for this or to wait for you = control….one therapy session i attended, i said can we sit and watch the clock tick for an hour, and that is what we did, we both stared at the clock, we shared that space, it was so powerful so peaceful, all i ever wanted was time and peace, i was constantly hyper alert of/for predictor danger, i was at that time with out a defensive system, without armour….it is the victim that is anxious, so lets find the root cause of this and express it’s trapped anger and rage, this sadly rarely happens…what is invisible/missed/overlooked is that abuse has happened and is caused by others controlling one, the state carries out the same abuse one is trying to heal from, i knew that when i was being abused….in 1959 when i was branded backwards by the state school, even though, it is some consolation that this teacher who abused me with violence, as i discovered 2 years ago, had a reputation for “striking terror into the hearts of pupils…abuse is controlling others by force…controlling or management of emotional symptoms, and/or the victim NEVER causes healing, why would i want to be controlled even more by the criminal justice system and care homes etc, it is just more control over the victim/person, why would anyone want that…the natural instinct is to heal/escape being controlled, not makes things even worse, put oneself under even more control, put even more control crap between now and healing in some far off future, that always makes things far worse…one could completely emotionally collapse under the pressure of it all, people often do, end up so medicated/gummed up/numb that healing is now a very distant aspiration/hope and has likely even abandoned cognition…more control makes healing even less likely…i discovered people had helped me in hindsight by taking a retrospective view, as one pupil told me years after…”we all knew what was going on, you had it really bad”, what should i do scream at the person and say why didn’t you stop it? and lose contact with all other info the they could provide, that confirmed or helped me resolve in other ways…freedom is escaping being controlled by others and is not caused by being controlled by others…the nazis used terror tactics to numb their victims into submission, so that they were compliant…no one is born evil it is controlling abuse that is evil, and causes evil people…law never heals trauma only humanity does…i detest scientology/behaviorism…

                • I should have written “We need new models to be put into practice”

                  We have plenty of new and humane models for all aspects of our dysfunctional culture. Unfortunately, ethical and humane models are at direct odds with the ideological and demented, cash making, tick box ethos of modern mental health support.

                  Support isn’t the right word for what we have now. Neither is therapy.

                  You said Dr Bob was contactable?

                • …and that ^ answer was to obd! :)

                • lucy
                  well actually the model of the 1st 1985 therapy i had, was very old, but more or less the same method as dr bob uses, but his is more refined/precision/unequivocal ie unbottle the blocked anger and rage etc for cure…yes, healing destroys capitalism by freeing minds, which is why its use is stifled, in favour of CBT/behaviorism, but also bob discovered a single model that works for all MHP’s, without drugs and/or ect which worsens prognosis…that unifies diagnosis ie bi-polar adhd schizophrenia all neurosis and psychosis, that he likens to PTSD…see link for the story and proof of the simple model of treatment he found/discovered/realized/uncovered…

                  http://www.nickdavies.net/1994/03/01/the-mad-world-of-parkhurst-prison/

                  “Support isn’t the right word for what we have now. Neither is therapy.” imv control/denial/abuse are the right words, for what is “mainstream now”,which is done to keep the establishment in charge…you’ve seen his web site his contact details are on it….+ vids and other details of his work..
                  he is still very much active with his work, refining his work, talks, spreading news of his work, etc etc ….

                • g fawkes
                  “I did not mean real help regarding social workers taking you away,”
                  why didn’t you make that clear?
                  then what? i don’t post this stuff lightly, your question was about evil, and what saved me, i have told you….as i have clearly stated, that is only part of the solution, i wish life was that simple, and it was persons…..

                • I’m sorry obd if you feel offended it was unintentional, but I am surprised that you yourself are not questioning why a policeman who knew what was happening to you did not arrest the perpetrators.
                  Abuse is no excuse for evil doing no matter how it is explained or packaged, but negligence in public positions such as the policeman in your case is not acceptable either, if he actually knew as you said that abuse was taking place.
                  I do not want to upset you further on what is obviously a touchy subject, nor was I trying to draw anything out of you on a public forum.

                • ps Using defensive violence if someone is attacking you is most certainly justified, to what degree I would not like to say it depends on the struggle.
                  Abusers within the state system should be brought to justice too, is Alice Miller fighting for that?

                  I am trying to keep my posts brief because I post quite a lot, so I apologize for not explaining what I meant fully.

                • g fawkes
                  “I’m sorry obd if you feel offended it was unintentional, but I am surprised that you” so you see there is no excuse for evil, i see that there is a reason for it…..as one that has questioned everything my conclusion is…only healing, and standing up for one’s health giving human rights, no matter what, is true justice, there is no other justice like it…

                • p s g fawkes
                  “Abusers within the state system should be brought to justice too, is Alice Miller fighting for that?” that is the core reason for her work, restorative justice…i too try to keep my posts as succinct and as brief possible…

                • I believe in human rights and restorative justice for criminals, I do not believe in locking them up and throwing away the key. I have commented about the USA still having the death penalty in some states, but it has to be the victim or their families in the case of murder that make the final decision about restorative justice, we cannot speak for them.
                  If in a family of violent physical abuse by the parent, the victim retaliated and killed the abuser, that is a different type of killing from the premeditated, mass suffering torture and killing that Hitler and the SS were guilty of and I can understand the victims not being forgiving, although some may be if they think it is causing them undue stress, but we do not want to forget lest history repeats itself.

                • ps I am not criticizing the length of your posts, I have been moaned at for posting too much so I am being succinct, you do not have to be.

                • g fakwes
                  i know that you are not criticizing the length of my posts…posting is not easy, and relies on so many different factors ie trying to be close enough so that the other understands, without writing a novel….
                  i don’t forgive anyone who has abused me, i don’t need or have too, it is not important for me to forgive, it is not my responsibility for putting my energy into forgiving abusers, forgiveness is not conducive to healing, as it actively stunts healing, once the trapped rage has gone it is job done….if they want me to forgive them, that is for them to ask…restorative justice, is primarily about the victim recovering self….it’s is up to abusers too want heal themselves… like i say wrath of god stuff is toxic crap…one does not need the abusers punished to heal, but they must be restrained if they won’t hear no!get lost and persist…people should also be provided with safe havens if they are needed, these as we know are sadly lacking….

                • obd,
                  Someone i know – who’s the most compassionate, fair-minded, humane and encouraging-of-the-talents/abilities-of-others, person (when not being extremely annoying): your first 7 or so lines above, sound really similar & almost the same in some places – to the things they talk about from their early life as what they’ve kept hold of. As well as other, traumatic memories & (not-insubstantial) resultant ‘ill’ effects. They have a very cute awareness of what really matters/won’t stand injustice/reject all forms of abusive behaviours; full awareness of long-term effects.

                  On a different note – in relation to the movement and containment of people crossing borders – did you see the film i think it’s ‘Children of Men’ – with Michael ‘Pull my finger’ Caine & Nicholas ‘A rare appearance in a film with a plot (?), as against the usual testosterone-heavy, set-on-a-plane type’ Cage?

                  Ps. Top film recommendation, this week & every week, if not seen, or seen earlier: ‘Sherrybaby’ (with Maggie Gyllenhall).

                • s n
                  to your
                  “obd,
                  Someone i know – who’s the most compassionate, fair-minded, humane and encouraging-of-the-talents/abilities-of-others, person (when not being extremely annoying): your first 7 or so lines above, ” how about secondhand lion, with MC and RD…i’ll check out your recommendations…

                • s n
                  just seen a clip of children of men, a must see for me….from the clip sherrybaby looks very gritty, true to life and definitely a story that needs to be told, i’ll put both on my list to see movies… :-)

                • obd, (& finally) !
                  sb is just a brilliant piece of acting (filmmaking) – much better than the trailers will make it sound. There’s a whole scene and a particular moment – you can’t miss it – (there are others too but that one is like watching life – albeit through a lens, darkly). The film should prob. be depressing by rights but for me it’s just very, very memorable and has some lovely scenes in it as well as the more gritty/harrowing …

                • SPOILER ALERT!!

                  Children of Men is definitely a must see. Loads of great scenes such as when the car is ambushed and the whole scene is shot from one take inside the car.

                • It’s not a great film in the way that … Butch Cassidy & tsdk, or cool hand luke or the lego movie are (Nicholas Cage is in it). You have to make lots of allowances & suspend disbelief more & more as it goes on but if watched late at night it’s easier … the scenes of refugees displaced by constant war/threats to security and the rounding up of people & putting them in holding pens have the most resonance for me but Claudia Winkleman would agree it’s a bit silly … & you’re correct about the car scene – i even realised something was very wrong in that scene & it did get steadily more daft after that now that you mention it – but the ‘good’ bits were still quite ‘good’ …

                  …. they’re fairly few though. Maybe just those few scenes/the premise worth a look – watch it and weep.

                • Answer above was to Barry Norman.

                • It’s a really good movie Shirley, a very disturbing but also uplifting story. I will be watching it again.

                • Lucy Sorry for not getting back to you. Everything you say about primary mh is correct and is why there should be alternatives, so if all of those you named are working for that such as Moncrieff etc then I am all for it too.

                  I do believe live in social workers are a good idea, surely it is better to have abuse forced underground,rather than blatantly being active for victims to suffer from, providing that what the supposed victim says is the truth ofcourse, which is not always the case.

                  I am not trying to detract from those that have truly suffered abuse in any way, shape or form, but miscarriages of justice do happen. I have never seen the films sherrybaby etc so do not know whether it is a true account or not, it might not be.

                  Oranges and sunshine was a good film though that exposed the cruelty of charities, adoption agencies, the uk and Australian state and many others, exposed by one brave social worker.

                • PS That Simon Wheesey sounds like a right mentalist!

                • Hey guy, I’m know that I generalise too often, but I haven’t got to my state of tertiary cynicism (full oak leaf and clusters) without seeing at first hand the bloody mess made by some social workers of the lives of young people. Accordingly, the spread of their actions is wide and whole families and communities can be badly affected.

                  Social workers, hmmm… ok, I believe that many of them (and the whole service) is no longer about supporting and helping individuals and families, it has become a floundering, hysterical behemoth that exists to provide jobs for the social workers and keep other agencies in business.

                  Yes, there are some stars. I’ve known, sadly, very few of them. But they stick out because they thought for themselves, had substantial life experience, had educated themselves well about the wider issues that affect lives, they worked hard and fought for their clients to get what was needed, not what was dictated by the system, they used intelligence instead of lazy prejudice and most of all, they cared. They actually gave the shit they were paid to give.

                  With the uncaring, greedy climate we have here now, I don’t think there’s a chance of seeing social workers of any decent calibre lasting more than ten minutes in the current system, which serves no one and is prone to life wrecking on a regular basis.

                  I am now going to look at videos of happy kittens playing with toy mousies

                • guy fawkes | April 25, 2014 at 1:10 pm | Reply

                  Job done then Lucy, you have rid us of the pen pushing academics and the whole of the mental health system, hopefully FOR EVER!

                  WORDPRESS AGAIN!

                • guy,
                  I think Sherry’s story’s true – but not as in it’s based on one specific person. MG is extremely believable in charcter (! i understand it’s acting – but not like ‘acting’ ) – it’s something like a Mike Leigh film, as though the main character/the story are pretty much ‘real’ & the camera’s just there, following them … but not like the carcrashians,

                  “An Angel at my Table (New Zealand: Dir Jane Campion; Kerry Fox): – the true story of Janet Frame, misdiagnosed with schizophrenia/sectioned (or ‘committed’ as it was then) at a young age, and ‘hospitalised’ for ? 7 years/’treated’ for severe mental illness – the combination of all that was done to her of course made her very unwell – it was in around the 1950s … but it’s an amazing/incredible story/beautiful film.”
                  (Claudia Winklebottom)

                • Hi Lucy – i am a bit conflicted now … & not for the first time.

                  Have seen it twice and there is the dodgy weird-technique car scene, mentioned & it is more & more extreme towards the end .. (i seem to have missed the very beginning both times then ended up being caught up in it).

                  I also think ‘Leaving Las Vegas’ was a good film (& Wild at Heart) – NC used to make some good films …

                • Oooh love Wild At Heart!

                  Once I find the dvd of Children of Men (It seems to be in a case for another film grrr!) I will watch and see this single take scene from the car, I sort of remember it You are right about NC, something happened, he stopped actually acting. Most odd :)

                • & where is William Dafoe these days >>> and Laura Dern?

                • something survived...

                  Leaving Las Vegas: man drinks himself to death. Suggest low-budget remake here starring Nigel Farage.

                • something survived...

                  But at times it can look like a current documentary… many of the immigration police are genuine fascist pigs.

                • That was just the dress rehearsal for their roles @G4S & JCP-).

                • Barry Norman

                  Come and See is a hidden gem and well worth watching. Hat-tip to Andrew Coates over on intensiveactivity for recommending this :)

                • Barry Norman

                  In fact, Mr Coates states that all politicians should be strapped to a cinema chair and forced to watch this :)

                • Barry Norman

                  SPOILER ALERT!!

                  The burning barn scene is pretty harrowing and the scene where the cow dies is pretty poignant.

                • Thanks BN – it sound like a really impressive film but hard to watch (a very fine blance). CW

                  ps. can the politicians just be strapped to a chair and made to watch Tony Benn declaiming the case for socialism, on a loop, until their eyes bleed?

                • Nicholas Cage and Bruce Willis

                  As the comments on IMDB say: “Come and See is not for the feint hearted nor is it for people who aren’t heavily into film.”, I will never forget this movie. It leaves a mental scar in your mind which takes a few days to recover from and you’ll probably never recover fully. If you’ve seen movies like “Saving Private Ryan” or “We were soldiers” and felt they were too strong, DON’T watch this movie. If you never feel terribly affected by movies, well, you’ll soon know what it’s like. Kind of like a Jean-Claude Van Damme/Sylvester Stalone movie lol :)

                • Primo Levi – ‘good’ (although he didn’t make any films); Saving Private Ryan’ – ‘bad’ …. might try & see Come and See sometime (++ time out for recovery afterwards) … followed by something like Life of Brian.

                  Thanks for the IMDB info – just realised that the car scene comment might not have been meant as a ‘criticism’ … have to watch the whole film again now (!).

                  This weekend’s: Fargo – tv series version/second episode – a little light relief in a dark world.

                • guy, no one is saying that being abused in childhood is an excuse for any further act of violence or abuse. What they are saying is that being abused in early life fucks up more than the parts that were molested and this is why so many who have been abused in early life end up with very fucked up lives. Sometimes they are the fucked, sometimes they are the fucker. Sometimes they are both.

                  It is never an excuse but it is an explanation of why some people can end up going on murderous sprees of any magnitude

                • Lucy

                  Being able to explain something is no consolation, it does not prevent anything from happening.
                  Most of the so called professionals are either over zealous and pointing the finger at the wrong people, or too daunted or deceived by the real perpetrators that children are abused or murdered IF THE NEWS is a true account of what is really happening in society.

                  There should be live in social workers who will be there and work and help out families under stress, suspicion or just struggling, then perhaps we will employ real social workers not ones who push pens and write damning reports on families and removing their kids to be further abused by the state.

                • guy, I have tried to respond to your response and it’s hard to see what you are getting at. Finding out and understanding the reasons why something happened are the first stages of any action to try and stop the thing happening again.

                  Certainly with childhood sexual and physical abuse and neglect, it is so well hidden, abusers so well practiced in their art, that it is hardly ever discovered by someone deliberately investigating. Too often, the abuse is only discovered when the person abused, talks about it.

                  Putting a raft of social workers into a family where abuse/neglect is suspected, frequently results in the abuser taking their practices underground. The models we have for disclosure and intervention mention nothing of repair, resolution or true healing.

                  As obd said, Bob Johnson, Rowe, Moncrieff, Masson – they are not within our current abusive system, they are ALL considered mavericks. They have all had fierce criticism and some have had their professional careers drastically compromised because they published not only their opinions on the faults of the system, but also provided an alternative.

                  The alternative they present offends so many members of the bog standard school of psychiatry because the alternative insists that emotion and emotional pain must be acknowledged and explored. Psychiatry has no interest in emotions. Modern Psychology hasn’t got much interest in emotions these days. Emotions aren’t considered relevant or essential. But without them, we would all be dead.

                  We need a new model.

              • where should be were!

              • something survived...

                Crap excuse. Hitler’s sister Paula turned out normal.

          • I suppose nowadays shrinks would wheel out the DSM-5 and say that Hitler has an anti-social narcissistic personality disorder. Not exactly clinically insane though is it.

            • J Goebbels

              so being evil isn’t nuts then? I disagree, but in an upside down insane world, where the sane are sectioned while the insane walk free and the innocent are jailed and the guilty go free, you were bound to come to this conclusion.

        • Whether one believes in controlled immigration or not, if there ever was a UKIP government (ha!) all benefits would disappear overnight.
          This is where UKIP should be attacked. Because for all the trends in society against ‘scroungers’ engendered largely by the media, when UKIP is exposed on this issue, they will remain where they are with precisely zero MPs.
          Thankfully.

          • & in that imaginary future, Farage would be our great & glorious leader … that’s just not feasible, surely?

            • (reply was to Dave on UKIPs dubious plans for ru(i)nning anything/anyone still intact @2016).

            • Similar sentiments were expressed about Hitler Shirley. Farage is a loony, but he is historically in the right place at the right time. If the present idiots in government had had any sense and instead of going for the austerity route, and a hiding to nothing, and started to invest in R&D and in in setting up new industries as well as investing in the people through building social housing and on proper training for jobs in the new industries, as well as reforming the benefits through the introduction of a Citizen’s Basic Income as of right we probably wouldn’t have to worry about political gargoyles like Farage.

              But, it seems that the lessons of history aren’t being learned. In the immediate post WW2 period the UK was basically totally bankrupt, and in some ways life was pretty austere in terms of things to eat and items to buy, but the country was fully employed, a social welfare system introduced, as was healthcare free at point of need, and lots of social housing was being built.

              The UK is indebted now, due to politicians agreeing to spend our money bailing out the failed banks – they didn’t seem to think it was an important enough issue to ask us about though! The people of Iceland said that there was no way they were going to bail out their failed banks, and even the US Congress voted down a bank bail out, (though it was later agreed to do just that in a backroom deal). However, the UK is far from bankrupt, and invest in the economy instead of pursuing austerity, which is really just an ideologically convenient excuse to screw the poor and workers even further into the ground, and give their friends a windfall tax rebate.

          • UKIP is the party of the squeezed middle, which is why it is taking votes off Labour not the Tories, the party of the richest in the nation. The squeezed middle are the same as the bourgeoisie who have never cared less about the poor throughout history, so Labour and UKIP both are against the existence of the welfare state. But UKIP offer a citizen wage instead.
            There are alternatives all gathered together for May 22 European and Local Elections on my home page: http://www.theswansnewparty.org.uk

      • Perhaps you could tell us where Ukip are killing off the sick and disabled like the conlablibdem policies are doing, perhaps you could tell us in fact one nazi ideal that UKIP has as a policy instead of just posting junk.

        • barry ukip
          blaming scapegoating/workers from overseas for the jobs shortage in the uk for starters….we need at least 4m wellbeing jobs in the uk where are they?, there will never ever be the employment levels seen in the 70′s…we need a totally new economic model, not tinkering/nitpicking round/at the edges…

          • guy fawkes | April 22, 2014 at 6:30 pm | Reply

            If we need 4 million jobs for our own citizens, why are we importing labour from abroad?
            My brother has lived and worked in London since he was 16 due to the work shortage in our area, he is a tradesman and never been out of work until the Polish workers moved in putting him out of work for intermittent periods and undercutting wages.

            • GEOFF REYNOLDS

              THAT’S ABSOLUTELY CORRECT GF…………………

              HAVE YOU WATCHED THE GRAND DESIGNS PROGRAMME?
              ALL THE RICH TOFFS HAVING BUILDING WORK DONE ON THE CHEAP.

              IS IT THE POLES VAULT?

            • unless we get out of Europe, we will be up the Swannee alright!

            • That has always been at the nub of the issue regarding immigration. It’s not immigration per se that is the problem really, but the fact that capitalism has always used immigration to undercut the wages of workers already working in industries, and understandably this causes resentment. It happened in the 1840s when the Irish were fleeing starvation in Ireland, partly because of the failure of the potato harvest on which millions depended, but also due to the lack of industrialisation there, which would have absorbed huge numbers had it been allowed to develop. Many thousands came to the iron working areas of Wales and undercut wages, leading to widespread anti-Irish rioting.

              In the early 20th Century there was a deliberate attempt made to import cheaper labour for Welsh steelworks from Spain, however, that attempt largely failed, as those Spanish workers were well organised and of an anarcho-syndicalist and trade union tradition, many of whom went on to be active in trade unions in Wales.

              Immigrants aren’t really the issue, but immigrants undercutting wages and conditions is – insist on equal conditions all round and immigration ceases to be such a problem, though it does leave the thorny problem of people in poor countries having such awful lives that they will literally risk their lives to escape that – I can’t blame them for that. We may find ourselves similarly desperate if our politicians have their way – think about it, it is the logical conclusion of where things are leading.

          • There is a left wing party for leaving the EU, called No2EU supported by the trade unions and endorsed by the late lamented Wedgwood Benn. Link on my home page http://www.theswansnewparty.org.uk

    • That’s a bit like saying:

      “I’m told to support this child molester , but I don’t want to as I don’t condone child molestation, however if I support this child-eating cannibal over there, it will be one less show of support for the one who simply molests them.”

  10. Can I just say that it’s not a matter of having to choose Labour over Tory, because Labour seem to be the least worse neoliberal choice available, but a matter of keeping up the pressure and resistance against the whole of the unethical and unscientific ESA regime at all times everywhere.

    Such unrelenting grassroots opposition eventually forced the Labour Party to bend and break in their complete support for the coalition government’s Welfare Reform Act (WRA). Now, because of the nationwide grassroots organised anti-bedroom tax campaign, Labour after much hee-ing and haw-ing, announced it will scrap the bedroom tax component of the WRA if it gets elected.

    See the estimable Kate Belgrave’s recorded interview with benefit capper Anne McGuire MP from June 2012 in which McGuire pledges Labour’s support for the whole of the WRA without exception including the bedroom tax -
    REFLECTIONS ON THE MAINSTREAM’S ACCEPTANCE OF AUSTERITY

    http://www.newleftproject.org/index.php/site/blog_comments/reflections_on_the_mainstreams_acceptance_of_austerity

    • Voting Labour would be the quantitative easing of political bankruptcy, the underwriting of the “progressive majority”.

    • Joe: “Can I just say that it’s not a matter of having to choose Labour over Tory, because Labour seem to be the least worse neoliberal choice available, but a matter of keeping up the pressure and resistance against the whole of the unethical and unscientific ESA regime at all times everywhere.

      The Labour party are a disgrace from top to bottom with one or two exceptions. The ESA shambles is just one instance of their complete lack of principles and decency. You also have a party filled with neo-liberal idiots who colluded with the Tories to speed retroactive Workfare legislation through parliament in order to shut off the opportunity for anyone to make comp claims. They instructed the whole front bench of the party to abstain from opposing IDS’s bill.

      Lame leader, lame party. Only interested in cosying up to their corporate mates and shafting the ordinary person.

  11. And don’t forget, it was because of the nationwide grassroots opposition to the WCA, the DWP and Atos which forced Atos to publicly announce it wanted to cut short its DWP risk-free contract to provide harmful iatrogenic quackology at public expense (which includes the added costs to the public of the deaths of tens of thousands of them at the hands of Atos employed medical professionals).

    It’s also this sustained and unrelenting grassroots opposition which has forced the glorious leader of the Labour Party to cosmetically disassociate himself from Atos, The image at the top of this webpage shows Miliband on a visit to Atos HQ in Livingston, Fife in Jan 2011, (along with the then hapless Scottish Labour Party leader Iain Gray who is not known as Elmer Fudd for nothing) where he praised Atos for all the magnificent work it does in IT and the NHS. So embarrassed are the Labour Party now about its former praise for Atos that they deleted the webpage concerned from their own Scottish website. Handily, a web archive site has preserved it for posterity here -

    http://web.archive.org/web/20130201203417/http://www.scottishlabour.org.uk/iain-gray-and-ed-miliband-visit-veterans-charity

    Also, because of the nationwide grassroots opposition to Labour support for neoliberal disability denial ideology, its leader no longer does impressions of Atos assessors in his leader’s speech to conference. In 2011 Miliband claimed that just by looking at him there was nothing wrong with a disabled man he’d never met before in his life, basically portraying his disabled victim as a sponger and a scrounger -
    Ed Miliband responsibility speech in full
    13 June 2011

    http://www.politics.co.uk/comment-analysis/2011/06/13/ed-miliband-responsibility-speech-in-full

    While out campaigning during the local elections, not for the first time, I met someone who had been on incapacity benefit for a decade.
    He hadn’t been able to work since he was injured doing his job.
    It was a real injury, and he was obviously a good man who cared for his children.
    But I was convinced that there were other jobs he could do.
    And that it’s just not right for the country to be supporting him not to work, when other families on his street are working all hours just to get by.

    • IN A FEW DAYS TIME JOE, I AM GOING TO APPLY AT THE COUNTY COURT TO SUE ATOS WHO GAVE ME MEDICAL REPORT THAT IS NOT WORTH THE PAPER IT IS WRITTEN ON…………….

      THE DWP STOPPED MY INCAPACITY BENEFIT ON THE STRENGTH OF THIS REPORT.
      THE REPORT IS SO BIASED AND DAMNING, IT WAS WRITTEN FOR ONE PURPOSE ONLY, TO DENY MY DISABILITY BENEFITS.
      THE DWP HAVE HAD ME LIVING ON £32.32P SINCE LAST JULY.

      I AM IN A TRIBUNAL IN SCARBOROUGH ON THE 29TH OF THIS MONTH CONCERNING MY ESA. THE LAST TRIBUNAL WAS HALTED FOR MORE MEDICAL REPORTS.

      ALL MEMBERS ARE TOTALLY BIASED AND DO NOT WANT TO HEAR ABOUT THE CONTENT OF MY MEDICAL REPORT WHICH CONTRADICTS ITSELF. INDEED, THE COURTS AND TRIBUNALS HAVE BEEN MADE AWARE OF THE INACCURACIES AND PRETEND THEY DON’T EXIST.

      INSTEAD OF WRITING THAT I COULD NOT MANAGE A MOVEMENT THAT WAS ASKED OF ME BY THE HCP***TYPED IN

      “CLIENT DECLINED”

      THIS WAS NOT RECORDED ONCE, BUT SEVENTY FIVE TIMES!!!

      WHEN THE DWP DECISION MAKER READ MY REPORT IT IS MADE TO LOOK LIKE I REFUSED TO DO WHAT WAS ASKED OF ME, RATHER THAN NOT BEING ABLE TO PERFORM THE TASK.

      CLAIMANTS HAVE BEEN CHEATED OUT OF THEIR BENEFITS BY A COLLUSION OF ATOS AND THE DWP……..

      INCIDENTALLY MY REPORT STATES THAT I SAT IN A CHAIR AND GOT UP WITHOUT AID, I DID NOT, PREFERRING TO STAND, HAD MY BACK EXAMINED EVEN THOUGH I WAS WEARING A THREE BAR CORSET, WAS EXAMINED ON A COUCH AND LO AND BEHOLD………………………….

      WAS SEEN TO STAND IN THE SAME PLACE FOR THE DURATION OF THE EXAMINATION WHILST HOLDING ONTO MY WALKING STICK.

      THESE PEOPLE HAVE NO MEDICAL QUALIFICATIONS WHATSOEVER, WE NEED TO INSTIGATE A CLASS LAWSUIT LIKE THAT AGAINST UNUM CORPORATION.
      ………..I HAVE BEEN REFUSED THE RIGHT TO APPEAL TO THE UPPER TRIBUNAL, CITING THE DWP ARE IN BREACH OF BOTH EQUALITY AND HUMAN RIGHTS DISCRIMINATION IN TAKING ACTION AGAINST SOMEONE WITH PROTECTED CHARACTERISTICS.
      THE COURTS ARE IGNORING THESE LAWS, FLOUTING THEIR EXISTENCE.

      • my report also states that i declined to bend either my right or left leg but was able to straighten them…………….

        takes some doing…….

        mind you, what do you expect of a tick box examination by an ex bed pan washer?

        • My heart goes out to you Geoff, Illegitimi non carborundum, it was an Emma that caused me all of my problems too.

          • g fawkes
            i have attended the medical center 9 times and i think i’m on my 8th appeal tribunal, so many i’ve given up keeping count, and they’ve not ground me down yet coz with your support and my self belief, i know i’m right….. plus all of the other disputes i’m having…ffs in my most recent attendance they even accused me of having a social life….my whole life revolves around my benefit claim and getting medical justice…

            • I have a daughter who I am financially entirely responsible for, I couldn’t afford to hash out an ESA claim – I could have lost her due to not being able to feed her. I had to go to the Jobcentre and claim for a year instead, while I gave evidence throughout the year regarding historic child abuse. If anyone is interested in how to do that without being sanctioned and without being made to do things that you don’t want to do, email me: my name on here @gmail.com and I’ll help as much as I can.

              • sarah
                the child horrendous abuse i suffered has not helped me one bit, until roughly the last 10 yrs, as healing from it has meant that i have had to see the system for what it is, toxic, to survive it, i have had to find ME…the only true justice is healing self from and inspite of the system….the only thing that heals is booting out the toxic crap that has built up in one’s mind….

                • OBD I know what you’re talking about. The worst part is how comfortable the toxicity can be. I’m still so choked with rage – genuine, heartfelt rage. Fortunately I am a highly functioning whatever-it-is-I-am. I’m working on a piece of writing that will hopefully resonate with the general public when complete; and if not, well at least I’ll have created something to be personally proud of and that my friends will enjoy.

                  You stay strong OBD, fuck the fuckers fuck ‘em good.

                • sarah
                  still choked with rage, trapped, frozen, caught up in throat, the highly functioning part, is you….but it will be held back by fear/terror, of expressing rage…….rage is very hard to express because our culture teaches us that it is bad, but it is not, expressing rage is healthy..please see the work of dr bob johnson, you’ll probably be aware that quakers are renown for non-violence and expressing rage, upset etc their slang name comes from quaking with rage, in the presence of inner truth, when tyranny and tyrannical views are confronted…i don’t need to stay strong anymore..once one boot’s the crap out, one’s natural armour is strong, complete, mind is known and own…

                • Funny enough I was at a meeting at the Liverpool Quaker place just a few weeks ago, seem like a bunch of alright guys.

                  Marcus Aurelius’ “Meditations” was a real turning point for me, along with Dr Phillip Zimbardo’s “The Lucifer Effect – Why Good People Turn Evil”. Zimbardo did the Stanford Prison Experiment in the 70s and the book has a comprehensive account of the experiment and also a larger overview of atrocities committed by – loosely putting it – organisations as opposed to the individual. I’d highly recommend the book to anyone interested in possible psychologies behind systemic injustice.

                  Here’s some MA quotes, he was a warrior and philosopher and probably my favourite Roman emperor: https://www.goodreads.com/author/quotes/17212.Marcus_Aurelius
                  :)

                • sarah
                  marcus is he the one who knows russel crowe? i have a lot of family in liverpool, not seen them for years…
                  yeah, i know of the stanford prison experiments, believe it or not people are submissive to rule, because they are often afraid to use the most powerful word in the universe NO! because of the childhood terror of it’s consequences….feel NO!, practice it’s power, it sets one free…

                • Hahaha yeah the one who knew Russell Crowe XD

                  Give me a shout if you’re in Liverpool or nearby, we’ll have drinks and times :)

                • sarah
                  thanks, i’ll bear it in mind…i mean it! :-)

          • GEOFF REYNOLDS

            NOT THE SAME BASTARD EMMA?

            • something survived...

              Right on cue I got sent a birthday present. DWP cut my benefits to £25 a week. My rent is more like £65 a week. WTF?!!
              I’m not earning money so what’s wrong with them? They wouldn’t return my calls to say why the fuck they did it.
              ‘The paper it’s written on’ is worth something – you can wipe your arse on it and rub it in their face.

      • geoff
        they now say 2014
        “We want the assessment to be part of the process of ensuring disabled people who can work get the support they need to do so, not to threaten or punish them. The test should be a gateway to identifying and assembling that support.”
        for starters, the whole system is biased by our fitness to fight it…they set up a pre-tribunal confrontation/conflict by using the WCA as an emotional weapon, and that IS it’s true purpose to grind the claimant down and to force them/us onto JSA and PIP…where we have to prove need, there are no penalties imposed on them for doing this….as to remedy this all they need to do is to pay backdated benefits, if one is successful at tribunal…no a/c is given to the harm that they cause by forcing the one to endure this barbaric process….they force the overstretched claimant to prove need, and going beyond what we have to do to ensure reliable supplies of vitals is too much strain added to what they have already imposed on us and they know this….if only we had a team of lawyers, and if we did the threat of them would be enough to get our entitlement paid in the 1st instance…so they basically attack the most defenseless…system is cream or park…GIVE ‘EM AN INCH AND THEY TAKE A MILE…according to UT rulings, the legal onus is on them to prove non-entitlement to benefits and the WCA “can do” is for illustrative purposes only and they are not supposed to make the “speculative extrapolations” that they do…”we realize that you cannot do the work that you used to do”, if they make a decision for us by claiming we are fit for work, and slashing our wellbeing benefits, thus choosing/deciding our state of health for us, by telling us how sick and disabled we are, they must also choose/decide what types of work we can do, so we can challenge that, and they then have to prove that we can do what they say we can, (the legal onus is already on them to prove non-entitlements to benefits)…yet now as things stand they (in 2 places at once, they treat us as adults who can make those choices) leave what we can do work wise up to us…which is a clear contradiction/conflict, as they can’t leave the whether we are actually fit for work or not decision, up to us…thus the WCA decision is incomplete…uncompleted…
        for the WCA to be valid it is only reasonable that they MUST make the whole decision and not half of it AND specify the type of work that they claim we are fit for, they must state the hours we can work and travelling times to and from work, simply saying that we’re fit for work is not good enough.. it all comes down to they control our vitals so they control us behaviourism…

      • Unfortunately, none of that surprises me Geoff. It’s a very common experience. It’s almost the norm. My sincerest sympathies indeed.

        Just to say, the abuse and corruption of British medical professionals working for the DWP and Atos is absolutely shocking. There are years of evidence from vast numbers of patients exposed to this nationwide human rights abuse of medical ethics. Yet the British medical governing and regulatory bodies (such as the BMA, GMC, NMC and the CQC) which could bring a halt to the patient harms and deaths almost overnight, refuse point-blank to lift a finger to save any of them. So much for their precious code of professional medical ethics.

        Even when a medical professional produces stone-wall evidence of medical fraud on the part of medical professionals, working for and on behalf of the interests of Atos and the DWP, nothing is done. See the excellent Dr Greg Wood’s blog (link below) who worked for and the left Atos in utter disgust at the medical fraud it subjected disabled people to.

        Work Test Whistleblower

        http://worktestwhistleblower.blogspot.co.uk/

        ps
        I like to contrast the tens of thousands of deaths of patients subjected to the neoliberal disablity denial biopsychosocial quackology practised by the DWP and Atos, with the endless bleatings about homoeopathy in the science sections of our national press especially the Guardian. Say what you want about homoeopathy, and I have no particular axe to grind when it comes to such Complementary and Alternative Medicine, but it doesn’t kill anybody. Yet the amount of coverage the largely benign homoeopathy gets compared to a really lethal medical practice such as the DWP’s “fit for work” ideology is bizarre. Just imagine if homoeopathy had killed 44,000 patients (an estimate I read of the deaths caused by DWP-Atos) to date? There would be medical war crime trials of homoeopathy practitioners. Yet the DWP and Atos are allowed to blithely carry on as if they weren’t involved in the biggest state mass-murder of disabled people since the 1930s Nazi Government of Germany.

  12. Reblogged this on Beastrabban’s Weblog.

  13. Theres helping and supporting, help is o.k forcing using a big stick [sanctions is not] stripping people of benefits just makes things worse, causing stress and worry and putting a bigger burden on the NHS which doesn’t seem to be taken into account financially. You cant trust any of te main parties they are all out of touch

    • The most sickening thing about all these policies is the government’s description of them as ‘helping’ or ‘supporting’ the victims into work, as though we were all desperate to work for its own sake, with such selfish aims as having some money and a home playing a very minor, if any, role. When the state offers to ‘help’ or ‘support’ you, watch your back.

      • “The nine most terrifying words in the English language are, ‘I’m from the government and I’m here to help.’”

        – Ronald Reagan

  14. Good article. They are all cunts. The leaning point here is that you should not trust cunts.

  15. Vote Class War ! Pirate Party, there are other groups and independents out there, and we need enough to start voting down stupid new laws that these toffs want to impose.
    Nu Labour can fk right off, we will see the return of some new deal crap of being forced into jobsearch centres all day doing nothing and being forced to accept jobs cleaning toilets or some other crap job that no one has applied for under their jobs guarantee ….
    Don’t trust no toff that’s never been in a Greggs.

  16. Also what rubbish about voting labour over smaller left parties. So you think we should all vote labour so they can get a majority where they all follow the same voting pattern as their toff leaders and dare not speak out. Yeah sure thing, if we can get enough independent MPs in then maybe some cons/lab/lib will feel confident enough to not just vote their party line and vote for whats right for once.

    • Would you rather vote Labour and get rid of this government, or vote for a tiny party that won’t win any seats? I don’t like or trust Labour but I hate this government even more.

  17. Landless Peasant

    There is no Labour Party. They ceased to exist when they ditched Clause IV. This lot are charlatans and middle-class intellectual infiltrators who pretend to be Socialists, but are in fact Conservatives.

    • How correct you are landless, the tories and labour know they are all about switching power from one to another.
      We could galvanize all of the fringe parties into one party worth voting for, but that would take a lot of compromising and once you do that your principles are out of the window.

    • Being politically objective they are not Conservatives they are Third Way progressives.

      • Landless Peasant

        The ‘Third Way’ only works if the goal of economic growth is abandoned (see E.F. Schumacher), and until they do that they are just Conservatives by another name. Lord Glasman actually describes himself as a “Conservative Socialist” ! and he is the main influence behind not-so-Red Ed.

        • Obviously if they abandoned a core believe -economic growth- they will be knowing by another name or ideology E.F. Schumacher’s statement is illogical like taking Socialist out of NSDAP.

          “It’s socialism, Landless Peasant, but not as we know it.”

          • Landless Peasant

            Schumacher was spot on. The only way of creating a just and equal sustainable society is by removing economic growth from the equation. A Middle Way between Communism and Capitalism.

  18. theres nothing lower or more repugnant than a bullshit middleclass socialist just like ed milliband and there rest of the chattering Islington middleclass labour phoney socialist bullshitters…they blew it..the working class people of this once great country will never ever vote for them again .

  19. What choice is there really though? Don’t vote Labour and get the Tories? Vote Liberal Democrat and get the Tories? Vote for any party other than the Tories and get the Tories? Labour are pretty shit but Labour WILL get rid of the Bedroom Tax, which as far as I am concerned is a bloody good thing – nobody else will do this if Labour fail to form the next government. The Conservatives are thinking about doing even worse things to social security, e.g., time-limiting it so that after certain fixed period it get progressively reduced and possibly even cease altogether (like America where you get five years welfare over your lifetime and not a minute more). Osborne has announced that he wants to strip at least another £12 billion from working age benefits, i.e., Jobseeker’s Allowance, Housing Benefit, Disability Benefits of various kinds and Child Benefit, which, I believe, has never been tried anywhere on earth before before. It really doesn’t bear thinking about.

    Labour ARE shit! Ed Miliband IS shit! We all know what Labour HAS done.

    But if it isn’t Labour next time it will be the Tories again, possibly with a majority, which will put every horror that has happened up to now in respect to social security, housing and human right into the shade. I will be voting Labour in 2015 not because I think the party is any good but because I KNOW that the only alternative, another Tory government, would be a million times worse.

    And that’s the truth.

  20. eviltorypervert

    i thinks its a disgrace you working class types are allowed to vote anyway.

    • To be honest the outcome for us would be hardly different if all prospective local candidates fought to the death in a local stadium with the winner named MP. At least this way they’d be giving something back to the people.

  21. Just a quick off topic note by the way, Bob Chewie has been in touch and is fine, just busy with some others stuff for those that were concerned

  22. idsisawankerabaldwanker

    my votes going to UKIP

  23. We have no need to all vote labour, only vote for those MPs who are prepared to fight for your rights locally and nationally. No need to vote for some tosspot labour MP living lavish off expenses, that is prepared to vote on legislation that makes his voters live in misery and poverty.

    Cons wont get a majority, if ukip are being hyped up then there is room for many parties/MP’s to take places of the current elite and start making the difference.

    We don’t need everyone all voting labour then cons then labour then cons then labour then cons. Because it does not work, we need to vote for who is prepared to represent our views and not mass vote a party who talks a good game but then its leaders gets its majority to vote bills that are against what they believe in.

  24. Pingback: What Labour Said Then, What Labour Say Now And Why They Can’t Be Trusted On The Work Capability Assessment | Translation Scrapbook

  25. http://www.nursingtimes.net/whats-new-in-nursing/management/labour-lord-calls-for-nhs-patient-membership-charge/5069491.article

    A former Labour health minister has called for British citizens to pay a £10 per month “NHS membership charge”, as part of a suite of proposed reforms intended to prevent the health service “starving the rest of the public sector of resources”.

  26. GEOFF REYNOLDS

    “MORE LIES FROM THE DWP”

    HAVE YOU NOTICED THAT ATOS CONTINUE TO DO WCA APPRAISALS FOR THE DWP, YET WE WERE TOLD THAT ATOS HAD BEEN SACKED.

    THE REVELATIONS IN ALL THE MEDIA WERE JUST LIES CREATED TO MISLEAD THE PUBLIC AFTER HUGE CRITICISM OF THE FRENCH COMPANY’S, NOT FIT FOR PURPOSE MEDICAL REPORTS……..

    IT IS BUSINESS AS USUAL FOR THE DISABILITY DENIAL GIANT, NOTHING HAS CHANGED.

    YOU WERE GIVEN NOTHING BUT LIES, WHICH WE HAVE COME TO EXPECT…………

    THIS FREEDOM OF INFORMATION REQUEST ASKING FOR THE TERMINATION DATE OF THE ATOS CONTRACT AND MONEY THAT ATOS SHOULD PAY BACK, HAS BEEN IGNORED.

    I WONDER WHY?

    From: Sarah Conner

    28 March 2014

    Dear Department for Work and Pensions,
    What is the exact date that ATOS will cease their contract in
    regards the assessment of claimants for work capability
    assessments.
    How much are they paying back to the DWP in regards to the
    cancellation of the contract.

    Yours faithfully,

    Sarah Conner

    Link to this

    https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/what_is_the_exact_date#incoming-498755

  27. GEOFF REYNOLDS

    “DISCRETELY HIDDEN FROM PRYING EYES, THE ASSET MERGER OF TWO OF THE WORLDS LARGEST PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES SAILED PLEASANTLY PAST ”

    NOVARTIS AND GLAXOSMITHKLINE

    WHY DID THE COMPETITION LET THIS MERGER GO AHEAD?

    WHY HAS THE GIANT CARTEL BEEN ALLOWED TO CONTINUE AND HOW MANY HIGH RANKING BRITISH DIPLOMATS STOOD TO GAIN?

    THE COMPETITION COMMISSION WHICH WAS FORMERLY THE MONOPOLIES AND MERGERS COMMISSION HAS NOT EVEN GAVE A CURSORY GLANCE TO WHAT IS HAPPENING.

    THE MERGER OF THESE GIANTS IS AKIN TO THE BIG SIX CONTROLLING THE ENERGY MARKETS……………

    JUST WAIT TILL THE GROUP USE IT’S PRICE RINGING ABILITIES TO FURTHER INCREASE THE COST OF DRUGS TO THE NHS….

    WE AGAIN, ARE BEING SHAFTED IN THE FURTHERANCE OF PROFITS OF THE MULTINATIONALS.

    WHO ARE THOSE THAT MADE THIS MERGER POSSIBLE, AND WHAT CONFLICTS OF INTERESTS WENT UNDECLARED?

    THIS MERGER SHOULD BE THOROUGHLY INVESTIGATED, EVEN AT A EUROPEAN LEVEL, AS THE DEAL IS NOT IN THE INTEREST OF THE CONSUMER, ONLY JUSTIFIABLE CONTROLLING GREED…….

    • GEOFF REYNOLDS

      TO ILLUSTRATE WHAT I AM SAYING ABOUT DRUG COMPANY MERGERS;

      From: Adam Funk

      8 April 2014

      Dear Department of Health,

      According to various documents on NHS websites, the cost of
      melatonin to the NHS is around 25p per milligram. But in the USA,
      melatonin’s retail price is about 1.6p per milligram ($9 for 120
      tablets at 3 mg each on gnc.com, for example). I would like to know
      why the NHS is paying over the odds for this drug.

      (I previously made this request to NICE, who advised me to ask the
      NHS Business Services Authority, who advised me to ask the
      Department of Health and NHS England.)

      Yours faithfully,

      Adam Funk

      Link to this

      https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/reasons_for_high_cost_of_melaton_4#incoming-505972

  28. GEOFF REYNOLDS

    HAS ANYONE ELSE NOTICED HOW THE DWP TRY TO DISTANCE MEDICAL EVIDENCE FROM ONE BENEFIT TO ANOTHER?

    ACCORDING TO MORE THAN A DOZEN RESPONSES FROM DWP, THEY STATE THAT A MEDICAL PROGNOSIS FROM DISABILITY LIVING ALLOWANCE HAS NO BEARING ON A CLAIM FOR ESA!

    NEVER HEARD SO MUCH BULLSHIT IN MY LIFE!!!!

    THEY HAVE NOW GOT THE AFFRONTARY TO SUGGEST THAT IT IS POSSIBLE TO BE FOUND NOT CAPABLE OF ANY KIND OF WORK UNDER DLA, BUT BE CAPABLE OF WORK UNDER ESA?

    WHAT A LOAD OF FUCKING TOSH!!!

    THE ARSEHOLES AT THE DWP MUST EMPLOY COMEDY SCRIPTWRITERS………………….

  29. GEOFF REYNOLDS

    “IS MY COMMENT AWAITING MODERATION BECAUSE I DARED TO NAME A PROMINENT DISABILITY DENIAL JUDGE?”

    • Smart Price Budget Value Mushy Peas!

      “IS MY COMMENT AWAITING MODERATION BECAUSE I DARED TO NAME A PROMINENT DISABILITY DENIAL JUDGE?” – walls have ears, Geoff :)

  30. To quote a well used phrase,”they are all the same”
    What we want in politics,are people who are not proffesional politicians,we need people who are aware of the struggle of every day living.

  31. I have to hope like mad that Scotland get the Yes vote as they are not only going to protect the pensioners, but they are getting rid of PIP as well as the bedroom tax. People in Scotland don’t pay the bedroom tax as the Scottish Government pay it for them.
    I will be voting Yes as it’s the only way that I can see the tories never getting into Scotland and us ending up being “served” *cough* by a tory government. We have ONE conservative representative and I think he’ll get kicked out come 2015 :)
    If we don’t get the Yes vote, then we are fooked – so then I will vote Labour as something has to be done about these evil barstewards in government, the only way that can be done is by voting for a Labour government.
    I wouldn’t vote Ukip if my life depended on it! It terrifies me that there could be a tory/ukip coalition – they’d nail the UK into the ground – you think it’s been bad with this coalition? OMG, it would be so much worse with a tory/ukip coalition.
    As for Labour in Scotland, they really need to get their fingers out about after independence should it happen – they haven’t got a clue about what they are doing right now and I don’t think they’ve thought about the future. I couldn’t vote Labour for Scotland in the May elections, my vote would have to be the SNP – at least they are actually doing things!

    • A substantial UKIP vote in the European elections would almost certainly plunge the Cons into an ideological civil war it could even bring down the condem coalition.

      That EU tactical vote in England would be more powerful than a vote for Labour.

      • Landless Peasant

        Only the insane, or racist, or fearful, or small-minded, or bigoted, or ultra Right-wing will vote UKIP. Anyone with a shred of intelligence will not.

        • I will vote UKIP in the European elections.

        • Here here! No one should ever vote for UKIP under any circumstances. Have you taken a close look at their policies?!!! They are shocking truly shocking and would seek to undermine the conditions of working men/women and set them back years!

          Farage and Co are all about the Tory agenda, only more extreme.

          Most people that are thinking of voting for them have not studied their other policies apart from the EU issue.

          They are a disgrace and don’t deserve the title of a political party. They are about using immigrants and migrants and stoking up that issue to create resentment and unrest.

          I repeat again no one in their right mind should think about voting UKIP. If you are thinking of doing that please read up on their other policies before you commit to anything.

          • The European elections are different from our own uk national electiion and I would not vote for ukip in the general election , but want us out of Europe.
            Europe has done nothing whatsoever for human rights in this country.

            • Europe is the only reason we have any human rights laws whatsoever. The EU is far from perfect, and is in serious need of reform to make it far more democratic, but without it we’d just be British Subjects rather the EU citizens as well – which actually does give us some protection.

              Even if the UK did leave the EU it would presumably remain signed up to the European Convention on Human Rights as this is something completely separate to the EU.

              Voting Ukip in any circumstances is a bad move – would you vote for the BNP in a similar situation GF? Thought not. So why are you considering voting for the acceptable face of UK nazism?

              • The Tories must find the European Convention on Human Rights deeply frustrating. It’s the one thing preventing them from getting totally medieval on our collective arse/ass. No wonder they want to do away with it.

              • SIB

                If the EU has human rights laws, they are very much like ours i.e. protecting the wrong people.

                The Nuremberg trials were set up after the second world war, but other than that our human rights have been trampled on and the EU have helped successive governments in this country do it.

                As for answering your own question on what I would or would not do if it was the BNP, then stating that ukip are the BNP, from where I’m standing all of the parties look nazi to me, those that are in favour of immigration are by and large in the labour party, where many rich migrants have migrated to and changed the whole voting dynamics in this country.

                Everyone is so terrified of political correct bullies they are afraid to say what they think anymore and that is not what I want for this country.
                People are becoming more and more petty minded, expecting everyone to adopt middle class mores and manners which are as pretentious as the mouths they come from.

                I will vote for who I want but do not see ukip as a contender in the general elections just the European ones, but quite frankly none of them are worth voting for because all look oppressive,self serving nazi’s to me.

        • @ Landless Peasant – “Only the insane, or racist, or fearful, or small-minded, or bigoted, or ultra Right-wing will vote UKIP.”

          UKIP are in the North East right now, on a mission to win over Labour voters – “UKIP are threatening to take working class votes off Labour across the North amid speculation the party has maximised the amount of support it can take off the Conservatives.”

          http://unemployedtynewear.wordpress.com/2014/04/22/ukip-leader-nigel-farage-due-in-north-east/

          Sadly, they might do it, too. In my experience, many NE Labour voters do so only because they’ve always done so, so did their father’s , etc. There’s very little thought goes into it, and many of them express views that would make the BNP blush. So I could quite see UKIP picking up both Con and Lab voters.

    • yes thats what the yes camp cliam there going to do but i very much doubt they will.

      the snp crawled into bed with repurt Murdoch and Donald trump witch dosent fair well.for there claims theyll protect the poor.

      • nuggy
        trump is not happy with the scottish govt atm, his view has been spoilt, by a wind farm… http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/02/11/donald-trump_n_4766341.html
        me i’ll vote yes and then see who gets my vote the scottish greens are favorites for me atm….

        • OBD: well said. What the NO campaign are seeking to do is to make this issue about the SNP. It’s not it’s far bigger than one political party. We have the opportunity to never have to endure a Tory government in our country again. To throw that opportunity away would be madness!

          The Labour party would then have to compete with the SNP for government along with some smaller parties. The Labour party would revert back to it’s true Socialist roots because they wouldn’t have to please middle England as happens in a GE and that reverting back would have to happen for them to win an election in Scotland.

          • raining
            we run a tactical voting campaign in 1997 called GROT get rid of the tories, we did, by and large 7 tory msp’s left, i think? and this paved the way for where we are now…we don’t have council tax surcharges nor bedroom tax, we also have free prescriptions, tuition fees were £1820 in 2013, free elderly care…summer is the 1st week in april, it’s often cold damp, with a gentle drying gale force breeze with horizontal rain and then there are these evil barstewards, the lesser kilted midges!

            http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Topics/Health/Support-Social-Care/Support/Older-People/Free-Personal-Nursing-Care

            up to a point the snp have done ok…yes, people have made a big deal of damning the snp and have missed the point or thought we would?…but in an independent scotland they are going to have to do a lot better to get my vote….

            • I seriously, seriously hope that Scotland attains independence. Missing that opportunity would be insane.

              Perhaps if Scotland goes independent more people in Wales would then consider independence as a serious option. We are another constituent nation of the UK that doesn’t vote for Tory governemnts, and though Wales has been a stronghold for the LibDems for many years, I suspect that is about to change.

              It’s just a pity that Plaid Cymru isn’t the SNP!

    • In Scotland you have branches of the new Left Unity Party, that are the real socialist party, that could at least be in opposition to a two-party Scottish parliament after Yes Independence success 18 September vote (link on my home page http://www.theswansnewparty.org.uk).
      Left Unity Party in Scotland – http://leftunity.org/groups/
      Dumfries and Galloway
      Fife
      Glasgow

  32. Up to 25,000 carers to lose Carers Allowance, no one is flagging this up at all

  33. Do any of these ministers ever get ill and have to take a few months off work? What happens to them? They are well off enough for it to not matter. All ministers wages should be dramatically cut down. All they do is annoy us.

  34. It makes it worse that IDS looks like a big baby, that somehow makes him even more annoying. Not only are we being told lies by a far right wing nut job but he also looks like a sodding baby while he does it. Oh great.

  35. Labour believe in sanctions and workfare even more than the Tories.

    They consistently said sanctions were right even for the sick. Charities Compass all of them were for sanctions. The only work camps were set up in the 1930.s one in the Scottish Highlands and one in the Midlands. LABOUR SET THEM UP.

    • This is why it annoys me so much to read other blogs and the Guardian and see people commenting about evil tory this, evil tory that – because, while true, it completely allows Labour to get away with murder. They seem stuck in the 1970s, when Labour was actually different in many ways to the tories.

    • Lest We Forget

      And under Labour hardshit payments weren’t available unless you were in a ‘vulnerable group’. The Social Security Advisory Committee and some MPs/Lords took the cunts to task over this but Labour didn’t give a shit.

    • @ Paul -’The only work camps were set up in the 1930.s one in the Scottish Highlands and one in the Midlands. LABOUR SET THEM UP.”

      They did indeed, but there were more like 25 of them, and more than 200,000 unemployed men were sent to them. British history they don’t teach you in school.

      http://unemployedtynewear.wordpress.com/2014/03/09/concentration-camps-for-the-workless/

  36. Picture a tory: dedicated to promoting the worst in people, greed, pettiness, paranoia. Protecting the interests of the rich and forever channelling wealth away from those who just want a fair deal. They therefore act in certain ways. They act in ways in line with their true interests. For all their revolting, unjust, lying conduct, they are who they are. This is what they do, like bankers who will ride rough-shod over everything to increase profit, unless reigned in.

    Now think of a Labour politician: what need do they have to punish people? They are not traditionally connected to big business, they have no fundamental need to create unhappiness and anxiety amongst the ill and disabled, or amongst those at the mercy of uncaring employers driven by squeezing the last penny out of them and society. They have the potential of vast support from those seeking justice and equality for themselves and for their kids, or just simply a bit of common sense for civilized values. Yet what exactly is a Labour politician?… A hypocrite and a vindictive liar. They are cowards pretending to offer justice. In many ways, on a personal level, that is worse than a tory. And because Labour acts in this way, Tory policy (whether under the Convervatives or Labour) becomes normalised, and nothing changes… except a further descent into a backward society, year on year.

  37. until tont blairites are kicked out ot the party then nothing will change it be more the same under a different master jeff3

  38. What was that hogwash about ATOS pulling the plug? Not anytime soon they’re not by the sounds of things!!!

    http://ilegal.org.uk/thread/8543/despite-wca-atos-laughing-bank?page=1&scrollTo=21537

  39. Though, of course, you are quite correct in saying ‘Don’t trust Labour’, when the general election I and many others won’t vote for the Tories. There is no chance of me or many ever voting for UKIP and Nigel Farage (fascist with a smile)! So of course many will vote Labour, when it comes to a Rock and a hard place the Rock has it every time.

  40. Another Fine mess

    The last 10 minutes of Newsnight was about “Robots and the future of work” and “The second machine age”
    Looks like unemployment is only going to go one way, IBS will do his nut.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b041v7rr

  41. There isnt any opposition in this country. its gone to far to the right over the last decades,all that’s happening is the hysteria has given the likes of Ukip ground.here for example.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/04/22/iain-duncan-smith-eu-andor-benefits-nasty_n_5189908.html

    With david blunkett on the advisory council for “the centre for social justice” as a chairman for example labour have turned their back on socialism.people do need to stand up and say enough is enough,but the tories have cunningly used propaganda to divide.

  42. Reblogged this on SMILING CARCASS'S TWO-PENNETH and commented:
    I wouldn’t trust Labour as far as I could throw ‘em.

  43. idsasbloodonhishands

    had an appointment jotted down by a member of my local job center bullshit office that says 10 am just phoned to to clarify when my appointment is to be told 9.50 am same day how would i go about exposing this deliberate attempt at making me miss it,,any help would be great. I’d like to add this is the 4th time a similar thing as happened!!! appears to be common to!!!

  44. Miliband looks like John Major to me, elected to the job because of who he isn’t, out of his depth and at the mercy of his party’s right wing. The time to establish himself as a principled leader is gone, what he should have done years ago is to tell the Blairites to fit in or fuck off and stood up for the Welfare State as Britain’s and Labour’s greatest achievement. Too late now, he simply looks like a spineless, clueless opportunist.

    Nothing to do with Miliband but another good Keiser Report on why the economy is leaving shit creek and heading for diarrhoea driveway despite what Gidiot’s figures say. http://rt.com/shows/keiser-report/episode-591-max-keiser-784/

  45. Nigel Farrage doesn’t seem to be serious though regarding immigration if his little speech on the news is anything to go by.

    “we will only let 50 thousand a year into the country and they will have to be skilled”.

    I hope he is joking – 50 thousand?

    The labour party is being run by the son of an immigrant so obviously is in favour of immigration.

    • A little problem with the logic of your argument there Guy, Nigel Farage is also descended from immigrants, though, to be fair they arrived a while longer ago than the Mililbands.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigel_Farage

      • something survived...

        “We can’t have those Huguenots coming over here, taking our jobs, changing our language, threatening our religion….”
        —-
        “in a Polish-built two-seater PZL-104 Wilga 35A aircraft”
        Polish-built: 1) the irony, as he was using it to fly an anti-immigrant banner 2) double irony, it crashed 3) Only a silver star to the Polish aircraft botchers, better luck next attempt. Nice try though.

        “he was diagnosed with testicular cancer but made a full recovery”
        Unfortunately.
        Could it be that the cancer decided that he was just one big testicle, and gave up?

        Miliband: A herbivorous/detritivorous invertebrate, found dwelling in leaf litter, with two pairs of legs per segment. Able to roll into a ball, but not as well as the Clegglouse.

  46. what the X$&k is wordpress doing with these posts?

  47. Maybe that’s why the centre has turned to the right, due to the attitude of the left at times.

    Why wouldn’t someone oppose being part of the eu ? You think the eu cares about the freedoms of the citizens it rules over ? lol
    Should we praise there friends the IMF when they force countries into debts they can’t back and force those governments to impose harsh restrictions on wages ? The EU aint some saints they are the same clothe as IMF.

    And why does every country pay millions to the eu every year, so that lot can spend expenses on whatever they want like farage and no fuss is made because its in Europe. You would kick up a fuss if your local mp was using expenses on moats to the point where you could protest them into giving it back. Are you going down to Brussels then to protest when they start messing your rights about down the line ?

  48. *Simon Wessely look him up, and look up what people with CFS and ME think of his GET system of physical and mental abuse.

  49. We need something new . I don’t know why they have voting at all because nothing changes no matter who gets in , petrol still gos up in price steadily clicking like a clock , nothing is given for free , earn £10k before tax is going to cost some other place . and guess who cops it ? yes thats right the most vulnerable. its every muggers choice someone who cannot defend themselves , the sick and unemployed . to make it even more twisted , they are even getting rid of legal aid ,that action alone it proof of pre meditated twistedness of things to come . we are all being forced through hoops into a corner then hit with bigger and bigger sticks for information we don’t have . No matter what party gets in , these hoops and corners are still there . Basically they want Britain to be like the rest of the world , with no dole , or free medical treatment for the less well off . They are stopping at nothing to achieve this , and bit by bit they are whittling everything away . Problem here is in other countries cost of living is a lot cheaper , so private dentist and medical is up to the individual to pay the insurance instalments . Here , we nearly all live on a shoe string so private medical could be afforded if we got rid of our phones and transport and bus fairs and sat in the dark waiting to need an operation .The writing is on the wall for us , just look ahead and see what’s coming , People are in a all in argument over what’s fair and who’s being racist and the workers have been turned against the unemployed by a very ignorant MP . things are happening because we have let them all fester , and it may be too late to change . the voting system is a joke because we have the UKIP who’s an x Tory so we now have two tory parties ?? and now what I read about Labour they were the ones who started ESA off in the first place , it isn’t easy to vote on purpose to whittle the numbers down , they should just have your national insurance number and a text message , easy , done with .But no , they don’t want it easy and fair , and we don’t have anything to choose from .We are all going to end up tagged in our homes with a bar code tattooed on our fore heads getting scanned in and out the house and if we are out at the wrong time tazer loaded Drones are going to chase us back in our boxes . The country is going to become overcrowded , , just look at what happens in overcrowded countries , they suffer terrible with things like No medical treatment , food prices rise , petrol prices rise , http://www.tutorvista.com/content/biology/biology-iv/population/population-growth-impact.php , ,,, We are heading for big changes and we have to adapt to it or fade away , already laws are constantly changing , being homeless now results in your belongings being confiscated illegal camping laws are still in and twisted as ever , and the ESA is the way to being homeless , the 4weeks it takes for the job centre to decide on your lower rate after the Atos medical is long enough for a eviction . if your not well and single with no family you are in dodgy times at the moment , money stopped through sanctions or ESA decisions , then evicted , then sent on a merry go round to hostels that turn away when full , then sent to other county councils who do nothing but bring your manner of dress down when you are wearing anything to keep the cold out . its all 4 weeks away for us all homelessness . and its getting worse . so keep complaining about your treatment before we are all silenced by the Rich .

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  51. Landless Peasant

    WTF? Why on earth would I want to vote for UKIP? Or anyone else who wants to leave the EU ? The worlkd is one country, and Mankind its citizens. We should all be working towards creating a world without borders:

    http://socialistworker.org/2006-1/586/586_08_Borders.shtml

  52. A world without borders will only be a world playground for the rich, who are already playing games with peoples livelihoods.
    When the world speaks up and acts together against exploitation, only then will I vote for it.

  53. g fawkes
    people have freely moved across/around our eco-system for over 1000000 yrs…
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/archaeology/news/the-millionyearold-family-human-footprints-found-in-britain-are-oldest-ever-seen-outside-of-africa-9114151.html …..only in the last 125 yrs has that movement been for POLITICAL reasons severely curtailed by cause of intentional ownership of a country’s citizens for reasons behest to state bondage, and other material resources…this makes likelihood of a spontaneous choir of humanity acting together, which is of course the very purpose of restricted boarders for the exploitation/control of peoples and other resources very slim, for many many reasons, global poverty, restricted boarders, being the prime generic and deliberately restricting reasons…ie to claim ownership of people and all other resources, everything is divisioned up for the purposes of capitalist trade, ownership, and the personal profit of a country’s establishment…our whole infrastructure is engineered on this basis..
    i really don’t understand why people would argue for even more restriction, as a cure!?
    the current, imv underestimated, 20m+ european unemployment will seem like helicon days in 10/15yrs time…this all started in british politics to provide economic advantage of expanding global markets for/to the rich, with massive communications expansions, airport expansions, containerization of cargo’s, large container ports and huge ships, putting transport on the roads as opposed to rail freight, etc etc, infrastructure change, all about collecting tariffs, tolls, vat, and other taxes at the expense of jobs, we become consumers, on an unprecedented scale, all of which has since shrunk/shriveled our local economy, with many without 2 ha’pennies to rub together and has grown the global economy….which simultaneously led to the marketisation of OUR state owned assets that were state owned on our behalf to stop or curtail this very thing from happening…selling off the nhs won’t affect me that much, in 20yrs it will be all sold off and at 62, i’ll likely be past caring or dead…but i do care now…skara brea
    “capitalism is the legitimate racket of the ruling classes” al capone..

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