Jobcentre Staff To Be Forced to Sanction Themselves!

jobcentre-formThe PCS Union has revealed that around 40% of DWP staff who will be working on Universal Credit will be on the benefit themselves.

The huge re-orgainsation of both in and out of work benefits begins next April and will see Working Tax Credits, Local Housing Allowance, Jobseekers Allowance and Employment Support Allowance, all brought under control of Jobcentres.

Of concern to the PCS is that the new system will extend conditionality of ‘work related activity’ to part time workers who are in receipt of some benefits.  All claimants earning less than the minimum wage for a 35 hour week will be forced to demonstrate that they are constantly looking for ‘more, or better paid’ work.  Failure to comply could lead to workfare or in-work benefits being stopped.

Some part time workers at Jobcentres are likely to fall into this group, meaning that Jobcentre staff could be responsible for sending their colleagues, or even themselves, on workfare!

Whilst this will no doubt amuse some claimants, this is an opportunity to send solidarity to DWP staff who are often low paid and under huge pressure from management to police and harass claimants.  It is true that in some parts of the DWP a toxic attitude towards claimants has developed, which has lead to some people on benefits being bullied or harassed by Jobcentre staff.  It is equally true that Jobcentre staff often take a lot of shit from claimants.

But unemployed, sick or disabled people, and low paid public sector workers should not be at each other’s throats.  We now all have a shared interest in bringing to an end the increasingly ruthless government policies aimed at those on low incomes, whether or not they are in work.

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193 responses to “Jobcentre Staff To Be Forced to Sanction Themselves!

  1. Rosemarie Harris

    At the end of the day we all have to work to pay the bills.but can we the unemployed expect some help from their union to be treated as civil human beings. I welcome any union into our fight with this Government as long as it controls it’s workers from treating us the unemployed as shit.
    Bring it on.

  2. Good grief.
    Lost for words.
    The idiocy of these people is just amazing. They must surely do it for some perverted jest.

    This government needs hanging from lampposts.

  3. This shows up the stupidity of, Iain Duncan Smith’s attempt at a legacy, Universal Credit. I hadn’t thought about the fact that this would apply to some who will have to impose these sanctions – it really is a disaster in the making.

  4. Pingback: Jobcentre Staff To Be Forced to Sanction Themselves! | Welfare, Disability, Politics and People's Right's | Scoop.it

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  6. something survived...

    A thought today on workfare and the Community action programme.
    Say the job is building a wall. Well, what if the wall then falls down? Who is then liable? What if the wall fell on somebody? And hurt them? Or killed them? Would the workfare ‘crew’ be charged with manslaughter?

    I wish for the day EmmaA4E is forced to sanction herself to 3 years with no benefits, and workfare doing a handstand in a vat at the sewage farm.

    This government of zombies needs stopping.

  7. How do we stop them? What can we do before 2015 and after 2015 [I don’t think Labour would reverse this]. These policies are literally killing people and destroying lives.

    • I predict suicides will be the result. When people are poor and feeling hopeless and alone bullying is often the final straw

    • All I do know we need this coalition out and firmly on the opposite side of the house and for them to remain there for the remainder of their natural lives!, I do not see Labour or a labour led coalition being able to pull all this back out of the fire instantly but I’m more worried what will be left of the country by 2015 if this insanity is allowed to continue as we all look on with displeasure.

      We must not forget that labour built the foundations for all this, Conservative have just picked up the ball and run with it and think they are so clever. If they had a single idea of their own it would probably come from one member of the party who retains a single brain cell, the moment he is exposed he will be kicked out the party.

      They do say it’s better the devil you know than the devil you don’t.. well.. we know This coalition all too well but they are certainly not the less of two evils. I’m no dyed in the wool labour supporter but It would be hard to convince me that labour would have been as careless and heartless in their execution of the welfare reforms.. the axes they use to make all these cuts might have simply been plunged into each of our backs.

      They say revenge is best served up cold, and how cold it will be once all this comes to pass, we know nothing lasts forever.. we only have to look at the last 16 years when conservatives were in power and regardless to how we look at Blair today.. at the time it was like being raised from the dead of capitalist fascism. Today it seems some people have not learnt a single thing about the past.. and keep making the same mistakes.

      People may still feel indifferent to thinking there is major issues but you wait this year when more people including those in employment truly feel the force of their axe work and I do suspect what we saw as a result of the Poll Tax introduction will appear like a walk in the park… people are tolerant but there are limits to how long that can be manipulated and treated like idiots with all the third rate propaganda they peddle. Some people need to know who really has their hand up their arse when they are being manipulated.

  8. It would be nice to hear what their Union has to say on this matter…???

    • Stevie 777:

      Here’s the Jobcentres advisers (PCS Union) website address:

      http://www.pcs.org.uk/

    • Visit our website, we’ve got lots to say on this and other government matters! We’re campaigning for the Alternative to cuts and austerity (and to this government)!
      http://www.pcs.org.uk

      • Be very wary of the PCS. It is a trade union with a very nasty political agenda, led as it is by Trotskyites who are the worst form of left-wing life. Their genuine interests are power, in and of itself and they’d sell out the ‘working class’ as soon as they’d used to to attain the position of power they crave. As Trotskyites they may, on the face of it, condemn the cuts, but secretly hope that people’s sense of desperation increases thus creating a situation favourable to their ‘leadership’ as a vanguard revolutionary party. Beware, these people are little better than the BNP.

        • However, that’s just the union leadership. As Johnny suggests, now is the time to forge solidarity with the ordinary workers in Jobcentres. Some may not be the nicest people around, but they are fellow workers, and for those who genuinely ‘see the light’ there should be a lot of support – this government is relying on fear to divide working and non working, and we must not allow them to achieve their aim.

          I think that from now on we will begin to see a whole shift in attitude from the majority of DWP staff as they begin to realise the full implications of this evil government’s intentions. Let’s not miss an opportunity to build a wider solidarity.

  9. I can’t understand why you jv, who is an activist against government policies should defend those that are carrying out these policies. To imply that abuse is a two way street, despite the fact job centre staff and also their counterparts in the councils and housing offices are the antagonists in any given situation regarding welfare reform really takes the biscuit.

    If these poorly paid or part time workers are about to suffer the same fate as those they have happily castigated, I’m afraid I can find no sympathy for them, nobody is forcing them to work there. I would not be forced to carry out this governments policies under any circumstances and despite what people have written about me I have never felt sorry for myself ,because I am a fighter to the end, not one who compromises or caves in to public opinion, especially when I know I am in the right.

    • People who insist that they know they are in the right and that they are fighters to the end….oo-kaaay?!

      Meanwhile, back in the real world
      Part time worker gets shit on by ConDen government whose policy is to divide and rule.
      I maybe wrong but still believe it is better to unite and resist.

      • I used to work for the DWP, i am unemployed i have friends still in the dwp, and yes a lot get crap off the unemployed some do deserve it some dont, its mostly the managers that are pushing the good ones into acting like bullies. they themselves have their jobs under threat. Part of me wishes these bad/evil job centre staff experience what it is like to be on the other side

      • I don’t think you’re wrong. Uniting and resisting is the only hope we have.

    • You may not like it, but JV is right: “We now all have a shared interest in bringing to an end the increasingly ruthless government policies aimed at those on low incomes, whether or not they are in work.” This is a tactical error by the gov – like reducing frontline cops wages by £4,000 pa in one fell swoop – an error which turns against them the very people that they NEED to enforce their policies. What an own goal, is it stupidity or arrogance, you decide.

    • “If these poorly paid or part time workers are about to suffer the same fate as those they have happily castigated, I’m afraid I can find no sympathy for them, nobody is forcing them to work there.”.

      If no one is forcing them to work there, then perhaps you would prefer to have a government department staffed full of robots without any emotions either way that just churns out the letters.

      Oh hang on, hasn’t the effect of job losses attributed to automation in government departments had that effect already? Outsourcing things like tax debt collection to private companies who have no accountability?

  10. Buck up, folks! Universal Credit will never happen. It is unpoliceable, unworkable and impossible to enforce. It is about as likely to fly as Howard Hugues H4 Hercules “Spruce Goose” aeroplane! It’ll be fun watching Iain Duncan Smith go completely crazy over the next couple of years! I only wish the wicked old fucker had some hair to pull out is all!

  11. joyboy

    There is not just universal credit that is affecting the unemployed and sick forced onto unemployment benefits, it is the forcing of people out of their homes.

    So what if people have spare bedrooms? It is only the poorest in society that are being micromanaged to the point of non-existence, young single people with no children may be happy to live in one-bedroom flats or bedsits, but when you have children or grandchildren for weekends they need bedrooms to sleep in, and this government is trying to break this vital connection for people.

    The sick need extra rooms who don’t need a carer to sleep over, but because they often have medical equipment that takes up much needed storage space, space that is sadly missing in a one bedroom bungalow or flat.

    Pensioners occupying extra bedrooms are exempt from this downsizing, for electoral reasons no doubt, but institutions seems to be the order of the day for those that are being found unfit by unqualified care assistants that are employed to do a bit of cleaning or shopping for them.

    This situation has been created by Tory government not replenishing social housing stock and labour selling tenants down the river to housing associations who turned rented accommodation into houses to buy or part-rent /part-buy, certainly not the tenants.

  12. some very good comments here.

  13. chibipaul

    How are they resisting when carrying out government diktats, how are they in solidarity with you? Nobody will be forcing those that work for dwp to undergo that expected by other benefit claimants.
    As for being in the right, I was referring to my own specific encounters with those working for dwp and local govt.
    It is unprincipled, self serving politicians and government agencies that do not live in the real world, otherwise they would be able to see what they are inflicting on others who are not responsible for the debt or housing shortages. I think you should take off your rose tinted glasses if you think that these people have your best interests at heart and are at one with you.

    • Sorry to disappoint but my glasses are far from rose tinted.
      More piss coloured and jaundiced.

      You see part time employees as some sort of enemy to destroy.
      I just see people trying to earn a crust. Am sure there are sadistic bastards among their ranks who love making claimants’ lives a misery, but not all.
      It is all well and good with the brave rhetoric against them, when you have no clear idea of how each member of DWP staff actually feels.
      Like everyone else they will be under stress from extra workloads spread over fewer employees in the same hours for the same pay.

      Blame the politicians by all means but don’t take it out on people that are ultimately being trampled on like us.
      “…unemployed, sick or disabled people, and low paid public sector workers should not be at each other’s throats. We now all have a shared interest in bringing to an end the increasingly ruthless government policies aimed at those on low incomes, whether or not they are in work.”
      I stand by this

    • It’s no better for a civil servant.

    • Thanks for posting that – going to Appeal Tribunal tomorrow – supporting a friend who has been placed in WRAG group but has long-standing diagnosis of bi-polar disorder (Consultant/GP have always considered serious enough to never have suggested any formal/structured ‘return to work’ or placed any limitations on what he already does to stay as well as possible). Reading around the Assessment process and hearing accounts like these really help knowing that others have been through the same – and that it’s safe not to take the conclusions of Atos as in any way likely to be correct ….

  14. ps how are you resisting if you are taking part-time work that undermines the funding of the welfare state you will be partly reliant on, due to no NI contributions. How are you resisting taking a job for such low pay that you are still not independent of benefits. Holding out for better conditions is resisting, you are just caving in to pragmatism and compromise.

  15. I wish you guys would read my blog
    http://www.clivelord.worpress.com
    re the weapon IDS has offered you in the report Dynamic Benefits. Aesop’s Fable: persuasion is better than force. Instead of trying to force everybody to find a bogus job at a time of high unemployment, just give everybody benefits, take it back in tax, and TRUST people, because unlike now, they will actually be better off if they do find a job.

    • Clive, a Citizens Income would be a brilliant innovation, and one that I hope eventually becomes a reality. But, in this context it’s an irrelevance, as the present Tory government’s policies are nothing to do with getting people into work, or even about ‘saving on the benefits bill’ as they are spending as much, if not more on the so called reforms, which in themselves are part of a Big Lie. The present Tory governments policies are about social control, and the disempowerment of a large section of the population. CI would do the opposite and empower a section of society that the present, (and the previous) government wants to weaken.

  16. Clive lord

    This government doesn’t want to give anyone benefits, so you are not going to convince them or their supporters to subscribe to a universal benefit for all. They have their nests well and truly feathered for the future,one that will not require a paltry universal benefit.

  17. Universal advice today from a JCP spokes-wheel, relating to their very own epic and awesome Universal Job Site – and pale imitations:-

    “We have Universal Jobs-Snatch now – you have heard about it, of course. You must have tried it – No? oh. But it is Great! Another thing is – we are now properly in The Digital Age – that’s what we say, anyway. This means there’s going to be little, if any, point from now on trying other ways to find work. The One True Way is to Search Online. Just so you know – All Job Seekers Will Have To Have an email address And a CV For posting Online! These should be given to us as soon as you like. Every job seeker will need to do this…. (Excuse me, are you still listening? It’s no good saying you’re tired!). All of this is written down here, somewhere. .. Next.”

    Outside of the planet that is JCP, in a place still sometimes still called ‘the real world’, rumours say that up to 15% available vacancies are online, with 85% being advertised elsewhere, or never advertised. It does appear that the (Digital) Revolution is speeding up, up North though, and It’s hard to understate the excitement claimants must feel as they are mindlessly pulled towards the brave (& they’ll need to be) new Universe; oh-so-digital-it-hurts.

    • If this sounds patronising in any way – it’s just exhausting listening to this stuff. Sometimes the person parroting it sounds as though they believe what they’re saying (as was the case above) and other times they seem to be putting on a good act and might well be dying a little inside. The difficulty is that they are now in the position of essentially reading from a script (which is changing as fast as it’s learned) whilst working in an atmosphere of fear – and loathing. This must mean they are either complicit whilst regretting it (and fearful for their own job/sanity), or complicit but ‘wilfully ignorant’ (or just plain ignorant) of what they’re taking part in – or … good people in the very wrong job who would leave if they could – or … security guards.

      There are some genuinely friendly people working for JCP – and I hope they don’t all leave at once. They’re job roles seem to be changing every few minutes and it can’t be much fun – they must be on edge to say the least and what ways do they have to vent their frustration? It’s either us or the paperwork. Recently, we had a conversation about libraries and my (then) adviser looked all wistful and said “Yes, they’re really hard to get into – work-wise, aren’t they?” – as if escape to a peaceful library was something she’d been dreaming about.

      DWP/JCP now have started to ‘meet themselves coming back’ – and it feels like a (very) bad comedy show where no-one knows what’s going on, so everyone pretends they do. If they do have to start sanctioning each other and even themselves, the atmosphere could really go downhill … (not sure where it could go in that case – rottweilers on leashes, maybe).

  18. chibipaul

    Those working pt in government agencies for low pay can always refuse to work there – I certainly would, but how that relates to me seeing pt workers as an enemy to destroy is comic book crap. I said they were not in solidarity with the sick and unemployed, they are acting like the scabs of those that are fighting and holding out for real jobs with real wages, not bowing to employers who can deny rights to those working pt.

    • Good for you.
      Us poor lesser mortals might have little choice to do otherwise.
      Quit their job and they know what the score is.
      You seriously need to think less in terms of your own high ideals and have a little more compassion and understanding for the plight of working people.

      Your politics may be different, but the lack of sympathy is not so dissimilar to that of the ConDemns.

      • This ‘guy fawkes’ chap. Probably doesn’t realise that government workers on paltry sums carry a high level of stress because they have to be sympathetic to customers and the same time as being impartial and have probably had 15 different edicts from their upper level management on 3x pay who are trying to cover their own asses.

        Whilst of course those same managers create a protective bubble around themselves that means that no shit hits them from any direction. (I’m waiting for a ‘welcome to the real world’ comment here. The fact is that govt departments can spend almost unlimited costs defending employment tribunals despite the fact that there is a ‘defecit’ means that someone from the private sector is more likely to win a tribunal against their employer’ – all at the cost of hushing up the public sector)

        How would he like it if someone suggested that no one was forcing employees of teh Crown to be on benefits?

  19. Guy Fawkes
    The point is to get the public on our side. The govt has overdone the ‘strivers and skivers’ playground level offensiveness. Chunks from a report commissioned by IDS can be used to expose the whole workfare edifice as not just nasty, but counterproductive and completely idiotic. This needs to be added to the huge practical difficulties.
    Meanwhile, back off JV. you are playing IDS’s game.

    • Trouble is.. just like Thatcher… this man is not for turning… pathetic in extremes we have these half-baked career politicians trying to walk the walk and talk the talk of Maggie… they behave like a bunch of women to begin with and feeble one’s at that, with an evil streak of arrogance for good measure. Reality is I detested Thatcher with every bone of my body but had she been PM today not one of those would be in her cabinet, I doubt if even Cameron would have got a cabinet position, maybe a silver platter position with his head served up on it with an apple in his mouth.lol

  20. Clive Lord

    I think jv can speak for himself, but how I am playing ids’s game by contradicting some of what he is saying is beyond me.

  21. chibipaul

    I have been made to suffer for my convictions and resistance by having my benefits sanctioned time and time again, nothing has ever been achieved politically without some personal suffering,from the suffragettes to the striking miners, what makes the low paid and part-time workers any different? I want a decent job that is paid well enough to live, something they all want, but are not prepared to demand by going without for.

  22. guy fawkes
    IDS’s game is to get you guys at each other’s throats. The stuff I am trying to get into the public consciousness shows up just how stupid IDS’s plans are.

  23. Just goes to show how badly thought up and planned IDS’s Mending Broken Britain plan has been all along based on utter lies and deceit

  24. Those who are caving in to what ids wants by following his diktats are the ones creating division, not me. I would actually love a peaceful life, but my conscience will not let me sit back and watch people be trampled on and I’m referring to the sick and the unemployed,not those working for dwp who have chosen their own path. I have no desire to control others as IDS does, I am no sadistic psychopath either, but I will call a spade a spade.

    • Those who work for the DWP have ‘chosen their own path’.

      I suppose that’s the same as those who chose to accept the workfare programmes have chosen their own path as well I guess?

  25. The whole thing is pure spike from Cameron down to the lowest paid tory clearer

  26. This is all part of the IDS Gang project: a completely insane plan to entirely fuck up the benefits system and to further smash the poor into serfdom as they sneeringly, cynically rip it all off for their fascist bizness cronies who will no doubt give them fat directorships, shares and pensions once they get the boot.
    Sick psychopathic bastard who need taken to The International Court of Justice to stand trial for cries against humanity. How many will die before this lot are stopped. HOW MANY! HOW MANY ARE ENOUGH TO SATISFY THEIR BLOODLUST!

  27. Privatised police. Unemployed squaddies with PTSD snapped up by G4S, A4e; unemployed, badly trained nurses and healthcare workers happy to di the dirty for Atos, Cerko et al.
    The NHS, crypto-privatisation to fill the pockets of US healthcare corporations.
    More discredited scammers like Ünum dictating policy.
    And on and on and on and on…….
    This has got to stop. We need help.

  28. rainbowwarriorlizzie
  29. Your are so right, but where do you think this help should come from, the unions? the media? decent employers who pay decent wages (if there are any left)?activists??charities????? Would you even want some of the help offered such as charities? it seems everyone is out for themselves.
    I will ask five questions:
    Do you think you should work for nothing?
    Do you think you should be following endless diktats in order to claim?
    Do you think you should be job seeking endlessly for jobs that don’t exist?
    Do you think you have a right to stand up for your rights without being told no rights without responsibility?
    Do you think you should be sanctioned for not doing/doing any of the above?
    You wouldn’t need to have to act irresponsibly, if that is what demonstrating or taking direct action is ? if your rights were not trampled all over in the first place.

    • Can I say they are all good questions and:-
      No; emphatically no; please – no; Yes; and no – this has to end.

      There is only one place the help is going to come from and it’s the people who do take direct action in whatever ways they feel able (as in the video posted earlier showing consent being withheld for an Atos assessment) who should be recognised for having the courage of their convictions. It sounds simplistic to say “if everyone refused/objected at the same time… ” – but isn’t that how workers have achieved their hard-won victories – by being part of a collective/as members of a union? We don’t have that. It’s hardly ever happened on the scale that’s called for now.

      It would need a substantial chunk of the 2.5/3+ million (and their fellow-low-paid workers) who are being walked over to step away from their own personal abyss (everyone’s experience and understanding of this nightmare is not the same) to make a unified stand. This would somehow have to happen without the support of anything resembling one visible union, and in significant numbers. We have seen the judicial review brought on behalf of one group of victims of Atos (not withstanding impressive changes which have and are being fought for across parts of the system). Is a broader, coherent plan, being given a unifying voice – for an all out protest/vote on the wider issue of what’s been recognised as a broad-daylight smash-and-grab removal of state support? Or not yet. (To state the obvious, going on strike isn’t an option over pay and conditions when not in work and minus bargaining power). Pleas to vote/not to vote in 2015 to try to effect change are alright in themselves, but they’re not a solution and not one for today. What can be done to start to change anyone’s reality for the week ahead, the coming months/year?.

      Whoever has found the courage to lie down in front of a racehorse (I’m not advocating it) or in today’s money, in front of a sanction, can only do so once (racehorse) – or repeatedly face sanctioning if they are a strong person – but it does indicate serious intent. It doesn’t seem as though anyone ‘up there’ feels the need to take the people ‘down here’ very seriously at the moment. It would take a special kind of achievement to reach out to the mix of many, many disheartened persons in every JCP in the country and organise a unified response – even though a good majority are probably in agreement, at some level, that things have ‘gone badly wrong’ and they are being ‘kicked while their down. So the sanctioning continues, and the numbers go down.

      If, as a whole, we allow the humanity within our society to be sidelined, it’s the whole of society, our children and theirs if they are able to face having any, who will have lost. (Not just those who are directly affected today). The result of a collective collusion and tacit standing by is too easy to imagine – it’s already happening. Sometimes the need is for individuals to take the moral high ground – striking miners/Greenham protesters – if these people hadn’t made their stand, today we would be less well-equipped to try to find our own strength in adversity, looking back and seeing the victories achieved, as well as the losses suffered, by the ‘little people’ in their fightback against injustice.

      ‘Injustice’ doesn’t seem a strong-enough word – lines have been crossed/crimes committed and ‘descriptors’ being used to cover-up barbarism are an insult to our intelligence.

  30. The chickens coming home to roost. As much as I admire your sentiment but the JCP workers in my town are a bunch of uncaring b——s about time they got a taste of their own medicine, Not that their colleages will treat them like us mere mortals they wont get alf the hassle

    • No. Working for a government department is a dream come true! You get the pleasure of being compelled to deal with everyone, that includes people who have nothing, people who are bankrupt, millionaires, billionaires (who apparently aren’t for tax purposes), muderers, rapists, paedophiles, people with mental health problems, people without mental health problems but have disguiesed themselves as having them.

      Oh and if you are on the right, yes we have to deal with those people you’d rather think didn’t exist because of your own prejudices, but half the time we wouldn’t know the difference because of course we are all paperless pen-pushing beureacrats.

      • You can’t be serious.

        Only Atos’s computer-based test can accurately sort the people who are in disguise as having mental ill-health from those with mental health difficulties, so as to be able to find them fit to work, or unfit-but-having-limited-capability-for-work. So there’s no need for you to concern yourself. Laypeople (unless employed by Atos) can’t make this diagnosis – it’s just too complex.

        • Wow…….

          Why don’t everyone in the entire country go to work for ATOS then? Because apparently making decisions is that simple.

          • Now you’re just being silly. Most wouldn’t go to work for Atos unless dragged (if they understood the situation), because they couldn’t condone the chaos and heartbreak resulting from WCA assessments.

            Decision-making at Atos is very simple but should be replaced with something far more involved (as before). If you know anything about it, it’s now well-documented that both the current and the last government (through Atos) have reached a point where they have ‘simplified’ diagnoses for people with complex health conditions to the level of a series of boxes ticked, in answer to a series of questions bearing no relation to the lives of the people being assessed – who then find themselves re-categorised and shunted from pillar to post, regardless of their individual complex health nee

            Many of us have close friends or family going through the process, and others have themselves been put through the WCA and it’s aftermath – some haven’t made it out the other side, and others are now dealing with longer-term detrimental effects. Meanwhile, the process is currently being challenged in court and the BMA have called for it to be scrapped. Still, it’s not (yet) the case – (well, it kind of is but put that aside just for now) that anyone who doesn’t hold a relevant, in-date qualification in this specific area of medicine, could diagnose mental health from looking at papers on a desk or a person who is in front of them (whichever the government department).

            The mistake I’ve probably made was to have a go at the the assertion that (some) persons have “disguised themselves” as having health difficulties. Just for clarity – do this group of people usually wear a comedy moustache? It’s just that staff nurses and other assorted health care professionals employed by Atos do complete assessments but they are frequently no more qualified than the rest of us in the area of mental heath. Yet, it’s based largely on their understanding of the seriousness, or otherwise, of complex mental health conditions (after asking a set of fixed questions) that they make a recommendation of ‘ill’ ‘not very ill’ or otherwise. This is something of a bone of contention just now, for so many people. It’s not at all clear how the HCP (and/or anyone else who isn’t suitably qualified) can be certain they’ve not made a mistake on the basis of papers on their desk/a glance at the person they’ve never met before but had a quick chat with, without access or reference to medical records, or a full an understanding of the medical history.

            • Shirleynott. I know all of this.I’ve been the subject of first glances many a time despite working in a government department. I HATE Atos. They leech civil servants as well as anyone on the other side of the DWP desk.

              Unfortunately it’s not going to be as simple as replacing one group of beareaucrats with another. Government departments have become so tied up with contracts that everyone at ‘grassroots’ level is affected. Yes there is a pipedream of just being able to up sticks and leave but most civil servants are unfortunately in the boat that follows those who saw the iceberg.

            • Banagram – I can’t give any credit to the idea that there are more than a handful of people who successfully (or not) seriously attempt to pass themselves off as having mental health difficulties – so didn’t understand your mention of it as though it was commonplace and taken as ‘read’/regularly uncovered in your line of work.

              Looking at your posts going back & forth with guy & others I am still not sure what point(s) you really want to have recognised and who exactly your argument is with? Everyone can speak for themselves and holds their own opinions but broadly there’s quite a bit of agreement in this and similar internet discussions that things are going horribly wrong (‘welfare’-wise). People might debate the detail of how to try to respond/stay sane and keep buggering on – but everyone’s experience is their own & what most of those commenting on here do have is experience of the DWP/Job centre in their lives – some of us past & present so we know the changes as we have experienced them.

              It’s almost impossible not to start wanting to ‘shoot the messenger’ (not literally of course) in this case ‘personal advisers’ once experience tells you that they can be responsible for withholding essential income for those around you whether or not those people have a family to support as well as themselves. I would not want their job. My conscience would not allow me to continue in that vein if it were in my job description and at all costs I would try to find something else.

              You do sound really aggrieved – and so is everyone else. I don’t really have experience of working for a ‘government department’ (only very briefly in a temporary role years ago) and you’re obviously looking at current events from another angle – what you can see. Any constructive suggestions would be appreciated but there is a common ‘enemy’ and they do have ‘representatives on the ground’ to carry out their wishes – and those people are just ‘following orders’. You may not feel this way and you’ve said you don’t work for the DWP but this is the focus of many conversations going on at present …

              Regarding job roles – I have been told that some job roles are changing more than once occasion since the introduction of U.J. – and that the focus for personal advisers won’t be so much ‘suggesting jobs to apply for’ as monitoring customers – which is all fairly obvious and makes sense given what we know of UJs and Universal Credits intentions. But it’s not going to endear us to them realistically so not surprising that some people are calling for them to just be got rid of – we can remember when it was possible to be in an unemployment benefit office and be handed a card with job details, then left alone to decide what to do with it – not threatened with destitution if we didn’t opt to follow it up.

  31. exactly what I said k davies. they know how to go easy on their own kind.

  32. banagram
    of course they have, do they know how to say NO!

  33. Banagram

    Are you saying that all of those that go on wp are homeless?

  34. banagram

    I have a niece that is a criminal lawyer and she deals with all of the clientele you deal with every day, but ofcourse she would not do it for a pittance.

  35. PS those who have had to leave the Army etc. for whatever reason are probably going to get these letters too, A computer can’t differentiate between someone who left the army out of conscience or someone that was wounded.

    How does everyone feel about that?

    If you’re on the liberal left you will be ‘serves them right for inflicting pain on others’ despite the fact that the person may not have taken part in active combat.

    if you’re on the social left you may need to accept that the person was doing a job (wether or not it involved physical combaat) for an ‘acceptable’ wage.

    If you’re on the right then you probably need to balance the ideals of having a soldier protect your ideals against how much you are willing to sacrifice against how much that soldier has already sacrificed to protect your ideals. After all, you got where you are by doing nothing at all so that sense of achievement should be applied to everyone.

  36. banagram

    What has the army got to do with wp , other than they were brought in to supervise the olympics, due to the work providers failure. If a soldier has been wounded and is disabled, they and other disabled should have the choice whether they work or not, they should not be thrown of sickness or disability and onto work programmes. What is your point? What has right and left got to do with this? Should soldiers follow orders and go and fight in illegal wars?

    • The members of the Army are going to get these automated letters too, they are automated because several governments have decided to decimate the public sector to ‘pre-war’ levels.

  37. Ok, so if someone who works for the DWP and has a recognised disability and resigns but ends up not being able to find a job elsewhere and for some reason disagrees with the workfare programme (their ‘choice’ to disagree remember) they should just blame themselves?

    • The only reason I’m bringing this up is because you seem to believe that those who work for government departments in customer service/clerical roles are highly privileged when from experience I can tell you that they are not.

  38. who thinks they are highly privileged? I think they are government lackeys, who will carry out orders no questions asked.

  39. banagram

    What should those who disagree with wp blame THEMSELVES for? not finding a job? Join the club.

  40. Your niece is apparently carrying out orders no questions asked when she has a choice not to,

  41. Your right, I only made the comparison regarding your clientele. She has to advise her clients within the confines of the law and you can bet for the poorest in society the confines are greatest, to the point of laws for them being non-existent, unlike that of laws against them. That’s the ruling classes for you and those who follow their orders.

    • DWP employees are as susceptible to government imposed sanctions or whatever you want to call them as anyone else. I can see that the divide and rule mindset of the cunsertvatdems has worked on you.

  42. So she is a lawyer who exists on clientele who can only depend on legal aid?

    Really?

    How would you feel if DWP employees had the same issues and couldn’t afford a lawyer? Oh I know, they are different because they have a job with the government. Hasn’t this entire thread taught you anything?

  43. what are you talking about? Her clients are from all walks of life not just those on legal aid. I believe everyone should have redress to the law if there were any laws that were applicable, but because legal fees for lawyers are so high and public spending in the form of legal aid is cut to the bone, not to mention the fact that laws to protect the poorest have been taken away even if they could get legal aid, leaves all without means in a bit of a quandary.

  44. PCS union should support DWP staff willing to whistleblow on targets, “lost” claims and documents, and decision makers who are ordered to obey ATOS recommendations rather than use their own common sense.

  45. Some DWP members of staff in that 40% will most likely qualify for legal aid, but according to to you they should be denied any public help because they worked for the government and should suffer because in your own words you have no sympathy for them.

  46. It is very intersting to note (as I and others had said previously) that the people who are working were calling the unemployed scroungers and shouldn’t be complaining about what the Jobcentre staff are doing to us.

    Well, now your in work benefits are under threat – all of a sudden it’s unfair what the DWP are doing?

    Suck it up you assholes – now the shoes on the other foot you don’t like it – do you!

  47. stop putting words into my mouth, but I admit unless they become whistle blowers I have very little sympathy for them. Some are control freaks, who actually like giving orders to the unemployed, but are willing to turn on the government only when their lives are disrupted or affected, and want access to legal aid that has been denied to those sanctioned by them.

    • If you need a solicitor, go to a no win – no fee one, problem solved!

    • I know it’s rude to interrupt, but is it similar to what happened within social work once levels of bureaucracy rose and started to tip the balance to became ‘detrimental to care of clients’ – when at least some of the ‘good’ social workers (those who had started out with the aim of improving peoples’ life conditions in some way) started to get out? This is maybe what’s finally begun to happen at JCPs – except that there aren’t enough jobs for everyone to have one, and job centre staff might guess this.

      When I had the pleasure of being there recently, there was a lad of about 18 doing work experience, who was sitting across the desk from me (being trained). We had a chance to talk for a few minutes and he said that he had come to be there having volunteered himself (he was a JSA claimant). If my understanding is right that having once volunteered, the next step is for JCP to then seek to make further volunteering a mandatory condition for receipt of benefit. I wonder whether anyone had mentioned this to him at all. And would he have any clue what was going on in there and how will it affect him later in taking his next steps into work? He looked quite comfortable with it all – but you never can tell.

      From what you’ve said before about your experiences over time – it’s not surprising at all that you say what you say. It’s more surprising that you still have the patience to make reasonable and thought-through observations which all come from your own, completely valid, experience in this area – and don’t just let others argue it amongst themselves. I’m glad you don’t.

  48. Cut it out, you have just put words in the mouth of all public servants by suggesting if they don’t do what you require of them (without any investment from yourself) that they are all weak-willed. You know what. I am disabled and even I don’t have the attitude you do.

    What do you mean “but are willing to turn on the government only when their lives are disrupted”. PCS has been campaigning for several years before this nonsense hit the general public but no one took any notice because the reforms hadn’t hit them yet.

  49. Sorry Guy Fawkes and Banagram, I didn’t mean to disrupt your argybary – please continue, I can wait till you two have done.

  50. so why didn’t your union bring you out on strike against the proposed benefit disruption in an effort to prevent the inevitable. Things were happening to those on the other side of the dwp desk, but the sick and the unemployed can’t go on strike so they demonstrated instead, what are you doing????

  51. obi wan kenobi

    You did not disrupt our debate you have every right to post as and when you like, as do others.

  52. Jobcentre Staff to be forced to sanction themselves:

    Just goes to show that Iain Duncan Smith doesn’t even care about the Jobcentre staff who work for him – it’s nothing less than cannibalism of his own workforce, though I would imagine it will only apply to the part time or temporary staff – still what are these people going to do about it – probably what the unemployed have done – find out everything they can regarding their contracts and DWP guidance relating to how they can fight it – time to start going through all the DWP documents as we have had to do to find out their rights.

  53. If nobody signs up to uj then computers cannot decide? What does it matter if dwp workers or a computer decides to sanction you, a sanction is still a sanction except it would eliminate the need to have jc workers there at all. Their job in the past was to find and offer work to the unemployed and sent those the were eligible and they only sent a quota usually drawn from those who wanted to apply for the job and considered themselves suitable applicants. Now they leave it all to computers anyway. Most job seekers find jobs through word of mouth not from job centre or work providers input.

  54. It means that JCP staff will have to sanction themselves for not finding a better paid job and would also have to sign themselves up to the Work Programme if they haven’t found a better paid job in a certain amount of time – it’s hilarious – I can’t stop laughing – IDS is a fucking idiot.

    I can see all these JCP workers affected, whistleblowing to the papers like mad.

  55. Ids probably has contempt for those who follow his psychotic orders too!

  56. He should just go and sanction himself.

  57. This now PROVES that Iain Duncan Smith couldn’t care less about anyone else other that Iain Duncan Smith.

    It also proves that he is totally obsessed with obliterating anyone on any kind of benefit whether they work for him or not, I think this will be the turning point – if there’s one thing you do not do, it’s persicute your own workers because they know all the in’s and out’s of what is actually going on in the benefits system – you know, the stuff the public never get to find out about – but me thinks we will now.

  58. banagram

    reading back on posts that have been sneaked in further up the chain, I notice you said I blame dwp workers for a system devised by the government – that’s right pass the buck, they cannot implement their systems without compliant people like you.

    What your disability has to do with attitude also eludes me. I actually have worked as a union rep in my time and know the argument from both sides , but I would like to have seen unions acting on what I knew before even new labour came to power and started it all off, being a student of politics and economics and why I was so opposed to new deal or the rewording of unemployment benefit to job seekers allowance, thus putting the onus on the unemployed to magic jobs out of thin air instead of business and governments. I was a lone voice back then.

    • I don’t work in the DWP.

      Governments of either persuasions could not have changed UB to JSA without consent of the electorate.

      If you really want power to the people then stop blaming the people instead of the power.

  59. shirlynott

    what are their job roles changing to? more paper shuffling.

    • Yes everyone in the civil service is employed sorting paper. Stereotype:WON

    • I think it’s just more ‘people shuffling’ (!)

      • Congratulations on more civil service stereotyping. My grade reads letters and try to help people. It get’s to a couple of grades above and robots disguised as humans make the decision.

        • Thanks. At the moment, you sound like you’re going for promotion but perhaps that’s because it’s been another stressful week. It shouldn’t be a competition between who’s life has the most pressures from ‘on high’ – that’s just what people in work do. If you don’t see what you do as people shuffling or paper shuffling but something more meaningful – then good on you and there’s no need to be defensive or antagonistic. As you know – there are plenty of jobs out there for those who want to try hard enough to find them and change their situation.

          (One of my extended family members is one of the heartless robots you mention – I don’t see them very often – we don’t have much in common generally but I struggle to understand how they are able to sleep at night. – At least you’re not them).

          • Nope, not going for promotion. I don’t even work for the DWP.

            I think it’s interesting that those who depend on DWP staff would rather they weren’t there though, simply because of the government of the day. It’s the very simple Daily Mail divide an conquer strategy.

  60. Since this topic is regarding the PCS Union I’m gonna put this video up again because it’s relevant (and also very embarrasing to IDS) “Scum of the earth and you’ve got cheap shoes” – Brilliant!

  61. I think there is enough on the video above for any songwriters to come up with a really good piss take of IDS – If anyone should come up with a song, please post on here.

  62. These pcs workers were demonstrating abouttheir wages and jobs,not about problems their clients had faced for years. Job content did not appear to be an issue, obviously we are not privy to what was in their letter nor to any further discussion that ensued.

  63. banagram

    I don’t blame the people that have had to suffer at the hands of dwp workers, but yes I do blame not only dwp workers but also governments, timid unions, the silence in both the media and the legal profession and also those in the public services who have carried out their orders also, you can tell me if I missed somebody.

  64. George Fucking Osborne is Fucking SCUM!!

    George Fucking Osborne has carried out his fucking threat, just received the brown shit-stained envelope: “From April your JSA will increase by 70p (1 fucking percent) Ha fucking ha you lazy, work-shy scrounger Signed George Osborne for MANAGER” Fuck, fucking, fuck you George Fucking Osborne you fucking cunt!!!!

  65. Guy Fawkes:

    You’re right but it does highlight the fact that IDS when face to face with the public (ok I know they are reps of the PCS Union) will be nice as pie, but when he makes a statement with no public in attendance, he’ll rant and rave like a demented madman because he knows he won’t get thumped!

  66. Well congratulations.. you have fallen in to a tabloid stereotype.

    I was highlighted to this post by a PCS member who is so timid that she has only chosen to speak against such reforms to an audience of thousands of people. Just because you don’t hear about when govt workers try and make things right for everyone including their own families doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen. (<<< Daily Mail Soundbite: Civil Servants only care about themselves)

    • IDS doesn’t want things on a right footing, this would undermine his entire strategy, government officals that try to make things right just aren’t listened to anymore by the goverment they work for.

      • So what is the point of union reps fighting for benefit claimants then? Because apparently they are the culprits in all of this.

  67. I never thought I would agree with the daily mail. Anyway I’m off to have a laugh at son of paleface film.

  68. Nice to have a none state-related-benefit hobby.

  69. If things heat up between the PCS and the DWP I can see IDS justifying a freeze on DWP recruitment with: “Why should hard-working taxpayers have to pay the benefits of shirkers who could easily work some more hours. I have the figures here…”

    • Thats the whole point, anyone working for the DWP part time or temporary and on in work benefits (even someone in his own office) would have to prove they are looking for a better paid job or face there in work benefit being sanctioned and be faced with being put on the Work Programme – someone who works in IDS’s own office being faced with that – come on, they would be the first to whistleblow.

  70. and son of paleface went to Harvard so i’m educating myself. ha! ha!

  71. Banagram I think you are getting confused between culprits and victims.

  72. song for IDS in Bootle.

    three wheels on my band wagon
    and I’m still rolling along
    the jcp’s are after me
    they look mad
    they look bad
    but i’m singing my happy song.

  73. I’m off to watch Mc Arthur now if Bangagram has no objections.

    • You sound as if I’m stopping you from doing something even though I genuinely don’t have a clue who you are or your circumstances . I thought you were free to do whatever you wanted, much like those JCP workers you so freely admonish.

  74. DWP Compliance Officer

    The Nuremberg Defence: We were only obeying orders

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superior_Orders

  75. generation XRayed

    This all goes I to the theory that Job Centres will be closed and the utilisation of online signing as well as an idea to provide signing at local Post Offices will go ahead. There is a barrier between JCP staff and its ‘customers’, so irrespective of who will be eligible for Universal Credit. Whilst Mark Serwotka and the PCS continue to fight against the policies, the government of the day although have lost the argument, will still ‘win’ the fight so to speak. The continued pressure by certain elements of the media on the ‘scroungers’ will continue and seep deeper into the JCP psyche. Most JCP offices are now leased by Trillium Securities. It will be interests to see what they do when the office leases for JCP offices come to an end??? Let the poor fight it out amongst themselves I believe seems to be the Tory ideal. It doesn’t matter who you work for.

  76. I’m certainly not gloating over this, my adviser at the interrogation centre always has come across as a genuine bloke and has always treated me with respect. He said when I last signed on that the majority of the staff there are terrified of April coming because there will be large job losses there especially with certain benefits which will be now transferred and administered by the local authority. It is frightening for anyone to lose their job, no matter what job they do or where they work. You have to remember that these people are only just earning above the minimum wage themselves and no one should take pleasure in anyone becoming unemployed.

    Apart from Cameron. Osbourne, Duncan Smith and Lord Fraud that is.

    • Recently Made Redundant

      It is devastating to lose your job :-( JC will just be as terrified of the prospect of losing their jobs as any flesh-and-blood human being is.

      • What you saying? That JC staff aren’t normal “flesh-and-blood human being [s]” That they are in fact automaton sanctioning robotic CUNTS without a conscience?

  77. All of the surplus to requirement workers from dwp will probably sign on the sick because of the stress of losing their jobs, now that they have successfully put the sick in the hands of jcp or sanctioned them.

  78. I’m not sure they will sanction themselves, but I am sure that their colleagues or management will only be too happy to sanction them instead.

  79. Landless Peasant

    It’s going to be total fucking chaos.

  80. You never know they could offer them extra hours or more pay and put them out of their misery – but then again pigs might fly. I’d like to see all of the job centres shut and so called work providers sacked and if that doesn’t generate enough money to create jobs we could call for reduced pay for local and national government workers of all levels.

    As banagram or whatever his name said the government could not have changed from ub to jsa without a mandate from the people, or in other words we just have to accept it, well apparently welfare reform was mandated via the tory manifesto but the pcs union are all of a sudden trying to change things with speeches from ‘timid’ speakers now your backs are up against the wall.

    • “I’d like to see all of the job centres shut and so called work providers sacked”.

      True

      Colours

      Shown

    • You couldn’t even care less that civil servants with various different conditions suffer dismorphia over their roles because apparently it’s just easy for all civil servants to quit and get a better job in the private sector.

      You are applying the same test to civil servants that you don’t wish to be applied to you.

    • But wont shutting all the Jobcentres just bring on the same so-called digital environment IDS wants to force on everyone?

  81. I’ve had to take the crap from civil servants why shouldn’t they take some from others, it’s about time, let’s see them at each others throats.
    They need to find a job producing something other than hot air and reams of junk mail.

    • True

      Colours

      Shown

      Watch out for Cameron he is behind you ready to thwack you with today’s copy of the Daily Mail (or Mail on Sunday)

  82. The antagonist

    You can access any site from a computer other than those at the job center to do your job search, what do jc workers do or produce for the job seeker, other than endless diktats and a card to shove your signature on.

    • Jobcentre.

    • guy fawkes

      I am aware of all jobsearch avenues online, but what I have objection with is being forced by IDS to use the Universal Jobmatch site at the price of my information being insecure on the shoddy site and adminstered by a thrid party processor.

      What you have suggested regarding shutting the jobcentres would just eliminate the human aspect of contact, and that’s big a mistake. On thing we do not need is a freaking machine decided our fates.

  83. Job Centre staff and claimants should join together to fight the Tories attacks on the unemployed, sick and disabled.

    Some on the Left have painted JCP staff as stooges of the state who oppress the unemployed but we should be together for a common cause.

  84. no chance!

  85. Lumpenproletarian

    If you’d been sanctioned and accused of fraud, you wouldn’t want anything to do with the f uckers.

  86. Banagram

    why don’t you answer the question instead of highlighting typing errors – what do those that work for the job centre actually do?

  87. Antagonist

    You have got a freaking machine deciding your fate in both governments and in the sheep shaped robots working in job centres, local government, housing associations etc. etc. that are the exponents of government policy.
    I don’t believe any data on the internet is protected from government agencies anyway, they probably want you to use the one site to make their life easier when checking out your job search activities.

    • No – at the moment these computers require an operator, which I guess would mean a human being to input the info.

      I agree UJ being there to, as you say, make life easier for them to keep track of your jobsearch activity.No data is protected on the internet and Gov has passed new laws granting them access to emails, web content, text, phone calls etc.

  88. what info is on the uj site other than bogus vacancies?

  89. sorry antagonist for making light of your data protection concerns, but if they can get round the dpa they will mandate you to it anyway.

  90. SANCTIONS DESTORY LIVES!!

    Fuck these jobcentre Nazi bastard sanctioning cunts!!!!

    • SANCTIONS MUST GO!!

      Too fucking right, sanctions are destroying lives; physically, mentally, emotionally and socially!! Sanctions are making Jobseekers UNEMPLOYABLE for LIFE!! Sanctions are KILLING Jobseekers!! Sanctions MUST GO!!

  91. JCP staff are mainly power mad bullies.Sorry to say it but its true.They lie and cover up for each other.Most JCP staff that I have seen take”shit”have deserved it.

  92. here, here blah blah.

  93. Jobcentre Staff To Be Forced to Fuck Off and Die!

    Ha fucking ha!

  94. Landless Peasant

    Here’s an email address where you can send all your jobseeking evidence:

    universal.jobmatchgg@dwp.gsi.gov.uk

  95. Landless Peasant

    You can also forward your jobseeking evidence directly to Lord Fraud’s office:

    minister.welfarereform@dwp.gsi.gov.uk

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  100. I am up at 1am crying, why? Because of the jobcentre staff. I learned i will be going to sign in every week now and im preparing myself mentally for the now weekly war with the staff. Every time i go to sign in there are staff who look at me like im a rotting maggot festering on the sitting area. The staff approach me, amongst the other unemployed and said ‘err maybe you should be looking for jobs at the jobpoints!’..i said ‘yes i already have’ and show the white slips..to which i get a smarmy look and off she goes..and everyone stares. I have A LOT of jobs on my sheet every week but she says ‘hmmm ohhh no its not looking good is it’ and i say ‘i have a job interview next week’ she replies ‘ok hold on hold on now, i havnt even finished looking through it yet’ in THAT tone..and after i saw her look through it before she called me to come sit down at her desk! I can go on with things like this each time i sign in. I tried looking happy but they dont like that. I tried looking sad but they love to kick you when youre down too. I am not a scumbag of the earth but that is how i am treated when i go there. I hate it so much..and i do everything they ask and im not a drunk or a druggie or lazy or dumb or whatever..i have a degree and looking for work..actually looking and trying every day! Why i am still unemployed after 6 months is beyond me…i try to better my interviewing skills and etc. I am a good person. I am unemployed and being bullied for it by the jobcentre staff! Someone needs to help us unemployed..the staff have their red hot pokers and are prodding at everyone until someone snaps! I saw it once, a woman shouting down the phone to the delight of the staff member..who proceeded to tell the other staff what shed said like it was the best part of her day..to the humorous sniggers of those other staff members. Its not right! They need to stop being allowed to treat jobseekers as less than human. Im paranoid they will read this and know it is me..because i feel targeted by them..but i also know that i am definitely not alone in this.

    • Chin up… they can be the scum, if they had an ounce of integrity they would not be doing the job they do and doing it to the manner they either love or are forced to, but if that was the case then they should leave so it has to be they are tin pot power freaks who one would happily drag across the desk by their throats and give them a Glasgow kiss for their lack of respect. You may feel they look down at you but you can look down lower at them because I doubt if there are many who do it simply because it’s a job and they would be the other side of the desk. These places have little to do with obtaining gainful employment with any integrity associated with it and more to do with fiddling the unemployment figures.. I know the staff get treated badly but hell!… it’s like saying “I just took lists of numbers in a death camp during WW2 for extermination” they are no less guilty.. and whilst that is an extreme example it’s one people know happened and today when people get sanctioned almost for just coughing it’s clear to see they are tools.

      • I fell out with JCP advisors when I threatened them under the Trade Descriptions Act. At entrance there are two large yellow boards one says a Job for everyone! the other The job you need the help you want, clearly not accurate. I told him if these statements were true neither of us would be there. So I explained this to the adviser who got 2 managers who listened and left him on his own. A frosty reception at every visit nothing new there.

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  102. Pingback: PCS Union Leadership Refuse To Even Discuss Fighting Benefit Sanctions

  103. JCP are useless

    There is supposed to be help for unemployed people via the Jobcentre Plus Discount Travel Card. Yet, the Jobcentre Plus (JCP) staff refuse to 1) acknowledge the existence of the scheme and 2) claim that it is “discretionary” even though the guidelines clearly states the Personal Advisor “shall issue” the application form to all eligible applicants.
    What’s really going on here is that the funding rules for JCP have changed and they now receive one lump sum of money out of which everything is to be paid, and they do not want to issue these cards because the cost of them literally comes out of their pockets.
    They have either stated that the scheme does not exist, or outright refuse to give me one, without any explanation or reason, other than “it’s discretionary” which, it is not. Discretion must be conferred by some body or by some act and there is no discretion in this case. I have tried to explain this to the people in charge, but they just don’t listen. They don’t understand the procedure and refuse to identify what guidelines they are using, nor do they identify the source and scope of their purported “discretion” (because there IS none).
    I don’t understand what else to do, as they refuse to pay for travel expenses to interviews and keep asking me to travel to workshops every day at my expense, out of £72 per week.

  104. Staff should go on strike or walk out and find another job if they have any human in them

  105. It’s so easy to talk this whole thing to death with every article that appears, my main anger is that benefits street programme, that is the most obvious piece of tory propaganda wrapped up as some kind of human insight into life on the breadline, I think it should be taken off air and certainly not have a live debate afterwards about welfare and it’s abuses, we all know who will be present for that!… if this kind of thing was focused on gay people or ethnic minorities… heads would roll and jobs would be lost, why should it be any different with the mentally/physically disabled and unemployed people?. It is indeed a form of victimization… the Tories are guilty as charged, as for the Job Centre Plus… those places are like the processing points on the way to extermination unless you are healthy enough to work then you will be busting your hump paying extortionate taxes to these rich assholes who don’t even have respect for those who are Hard Working… it’s the journey to the grave in serving the so-called upper classes… serf in all but name.. based on the lowest level of survival to ill’s and bills.

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  107. It is the same as how they ran the death camps in the second world war. They got the prisoners to police themselves. This goes right back to the truly disturbing times and philosophy of John Calvin. Funny how similar it is really.

  108. simply put i have no sympathy for those that cause another heartache… honestly…. i couldn’t care less about DWP staff if they were david cameron…
    like Doctors and lawyers they complicit in this genocide

    • In the Garden of Eden

      Well then so are you being complicit by not doing anything about it bar just commenting on a website?

  109. jobcenter staff like the nazis of ww2 they are only “following orders”.
    plus they are at the near end of bottom of pile bar the “unemployed” who they love to take the pee out of, for it makes the jobcenter staff so empowered!.
    also “security” take the pee and strut up looking for a argument or even create one to get their “jollies in thuggery”.
    southend on sea the armpit of england is not the best place to be when unemployed!.

  110. Pingback: Simon Stevens, Maria Miller, job centres | Gabriel Vents

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